VoyForums
[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, 2, 3, [4] ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 07:53:47 07/02/09 Thu
Author: Jeffman
Subject: I agree that what we have is broke
In reply to: Paul Davis 's message, "I guess it depends on how you look at it" on 06:14:20 06/30/09 Tue

But what they are suggesting replacing it with isnt going to fix it and in some cases might make it worse.

Ive ran into the insurance thing already with my dentist. They no longer take blue cross because blue cross has refused for 10 years to up the amount they pay for things as simple as cleaning, even though the cost of living has gone up considerably. So last time I was in they said.. "sorry but we cant do business at a loss just because someone has Blue Cross insurance, we cant run a business on a break even or lose money basis".

There really is a catch22 when it comes to medical. It would be nice if you could free market it but usually when you need something you need it now not later. So if you go to the emergency room to get an appedix operation.. they got you... from start to finish on costs. My son had his appendix taken out in November last year. Cost was about 20K... come on.. for a 2 hour procedure and then two days in a semi-private room? There is something incredibly wrong with a system that has a 2 hour operation + 2 days of watching and its basically 10K+ per day..

The writing is on the wall on the healthcare changes that they want to put in..... Since my wife and I together make about 140K I expect that we will be getting hit with some new taxes to pay for this. The promise was no new taxes for anyone making 250K but dont hold your breath. Between healthcare and the cap and trade stuff that just passed the house (which means new energy taxes)... its going to be a painful few years in terms of finances.


>The situation now is chaotic, and will shortly break
>down in a chaotic way if something isn't done. That's
>self evident if you just step back from your local
>interests for a minute, ask a few questions and bug
>your eyes at the answers.
>
>For instance, many family doctors are simply not going
>to accept insurance any longer. They'll tell you
>flatly that they are getting paid about 1/3 of what
>they bill, even allowing for the co pay you give them
>up front. Friend of mine posted a letter online that
>says essentially his family doctor made about 9000$
>off running a clinic last year, and he'd lose money if
>he accepted insurance this year at the rates they are
>paying now. So he cut his fees, dropped the expensive
>systems for filing claims, laid off the two people who
>filed the claims, and flatly isn't taking any
>insurance at all.
>
>Ask your doctor, I have, and they'll fill your ears in
>a hurry. The family doctor has been kicked to the
>curb just as hard as the 47 million citizens without
>medical insurance.
>
>Want more evidence of a broken system?
>
>Ok, how's this? If I drive over to a Lilly's
>warehouse, and watch them load up a load of pills,
>follow them across the border into Canada, and watch
>them break it down and deliver those pills to Canadien
>pharmacies, and then walk in and fill a prescription,
>I can be arrested when I reenter the US! Why?
>Because those pills are "unsafe" since I bought those
>US made and manufactured pills in another country.
>Same applies to Mexico or Europe. Now, excuse me, but
>that's insane logic and insane law passed solely to
>encourage massive profits and guarantees of future
>profit - there is obviously no safety issue involved.
>Flatly, if I manufacture something, ANYTHING in the
>USA, and then send it overseas to sell at a lower
>price than the identical item in the US, I'm obviously
>price gouging US citizens. If the law supports this,
>then the law is obviously bought and paid for by the
>business in question. There can't be any exception to
>this.
>
>Price gouging and cartels - and there is no other
>correct word to apply to the US drug industry - always
>result in massive shocks and breakdowns in any system
>where they manage to become effective. See the wiki
>article on OPEC.
>
>I could mention the insane state laws that force
>hospitals to suck it up on paying for emergency room
>usage by indigents, or the crazy medical schools that
>work to lower the number of qualified doctors, or the
>absolutely maddening idea that we should import
>doctors from India instead of training them here - but
>what's the point?
>
>The system is BROKEN. Shattered. Fini! It ain't
>working any more, and if you think it is, you simply
>have not been sick enough to really need it in the
>last year or so. Medicare is propping the whole mess
>up, but even that's very close to simply breaking
>under the stress.
>
>It's busted. Patching it isn't going to work, and
>this bill is no better than a patch. We need to tear
>it to the ground and start over. And the sole and
>only working model in the world to build up from is -
>guess what - the model that works for every other
>industrialized nation. If you've got a better idea,
>now is the time to promote it. But "lets keep on with
>what we've been doing" won't fly, because it broke.
>
>
>>Tjere are some very large downsides to national
>>healthcare. I expect this to be VERY VERY expensive on
>>a scale that dwarfs what we have today. Remember I
>>said because its coming. Worse.. going in, I expect I
>>will be paying for my own insurance and then paying
>>taxes on the employers share which is not a small
>>amount. So I expect to have to pay more. So again tell
>>me how this is going to benefit everyone? How is it
>>reining in costs if its costing more?
>>
>>There will be significant tax increases coming to pay
>>for this as well and expect the middle class to be hit
>>and hit hard.
>>
>>>Is it just me, or does the arguement "government
>can't
>>>do things right" and "private insurance can't compete
>>>with a public plan" seem to be contradicting itself?
>>>
>>>It's nonsense anyhow, what serves every other country
>>>in the world (single payer) would probably do as well
>>>in the US. And our system is just about to fall to
>>>pieces totally. Odd thing is that most don't realize
>>>that.

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[ Contact Forum Admin ]

Forum timezone: GMT-8
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.