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Date Posted: 20:20:38 01/26/05 Wed
Author: Joe
Subject: Re: What to do as a Christian in politics?
In reply to: X 's message, "Re: What to do as a Christian in politics?" on 19:09:13 01/26/05 Wed

>MacArthur is not being a moral relativist.

That's not what I believe or stated about MacArthur. He's an admirable person, someone who clearly stated what the gospel of Jesus means on Larry King Live, while a supposed Methodist Bishop spewed pantheism.

I believe my point was that politics and political action is as valid a way for Christians to glorify God and express the Christian worldview--that of moral absolutes and truth--as any other way. If a Christian is led to run for political office, what choice does he have but to take political positions that are consistent with his world view; he has to push a particular political point of view, even certain pieces of legislation. Would you take that away from him? Tell him that Christians have no place in politics? (just as some would say that Christians have no place in the arts or humanities or sciences?)

>Look at Jerry Falwell in order to push his Moral
>Majority, he is working with such unsavory characters
>as Sun Myung Moon (See Kingdom of the Cults, Steve
>Hassan website) to push his political agenda. Do you
>think Falwell is going to attack Moon¡¯s message where
>Moon says he God on one hand and accept money from
>Moon with the other? Do you think the millions of
>people who are deceived by Moon and going to hell as
>result of his teachings are worth it to push a
>political agenda.

The true story is that Falwell was seduced by Moon's wealth and allowed Moon to bail out his Liberty University when it was in financial trouble. It is a pathetic story, and Falwell is a pathetic man and certainly not representative of Christians who choose to be politically active or interested in politics.

>If UBF decided they were going to
>form political action group for the Republicans and
>started denouncing Democrats as evil scum of the
>earth, would you overlook their behavior for the last
>30 years in order to get a piece of legislation passed?

Er, no. Just because someone may take some of the same political positions that I take does not make them my ally. A Christian can be "salt and light" in the important societal arena of politics by exemplifying and upholding the Christian worldview of absolute morals and objective truth. Such a Christian should know that Moon and UBF stand for the opposite: the ends justify the means and whatever Dear Leader says is the truth.

>The same is true of James Dobson. He is now watering
>down his preaching to placate his political allies
>like the Mormons, Jehovah Witness, and Catholics to
>push agenda. These groups have led millions of people
>to hell, do you think a piece legislation is worth
>those lives.

I don't have an opinion one way or another about Dobson. I look more to people like Colson. But about legislation: legislation was part of what ended slavery and apartheid and legislation was part of what ended segregation and child labor. Legislation is not a bad word and should not be to genuine Christians, just as "the humanities," "arts" and "sciences" should not be bad words.

>Also look at Bush, for his political agenda he rebuked
>Franklin Graham for condemning Islam even though what
>Franklin Graham said is true. Do you think the
>billions of lives dying under the false teachings of
>Mohomet are worth peace in a political party?

That's Bush being politically correct and afraid, not relativistic. All in all, though, Bush is probably the most morally resolute President we've had in a long time.

>In term of being salt and light of the world,
>Christian are to do this through living a holy life by
>helping the poor, living a life that glorifies God,
>and preaching the true gospel. Look at Acts, they
>didn¡¯t try to form a political party. They didn¡¯t
>fight a war against Rome or form a political party to
>fight against it influences. They didn't ally
>themselves with the Saduccess and Pharisee to push
>their political agenda. They changed the world through
>their lives and the preaching of the Word.

and the politicians, rulers and governors who converted to Christianity did not stop being politicians, rulers and governors; but their political views and political conduct probably did change, radically.

>The reason why this country is in such bad shape is
>not because there is no legislation against abortion,
>homosexuality, or the products of Hollywood, etc. They
>are symptoms of sin.

Disease and poverty: also symptoms of sin. Do we then stop treating the ill and feeding and sheltering the poor and "just preach the gospel?"

>The primary reason is that churches are watering down
>the gospel for political, monetary and attendance
>reasons.

I don't think the moral decline of American society and the rise of secularism and political correctness can be blamed on churches. The rise of secularism coincided with the decline in church attendance, not with the rise of "seeker-sensitive mega-churches."

>Only the gospel can change people. Only the
>gospel can save people lives.

Of course. But as you wrote some sentences ago, "help the poor, live lives that glorify God." I'm not sure why political action, when done right, can't be a means to glorify God and be "salt and light." Let me be clear that I would also have a problem with Christians who see political action as THE answer. I've also heard "just preach the gospel" too many times from people (especially UBFers) who just don't want to think about the hard issues such as poverty and abortion.

>John 18:36
>Jesus Answered, ¡°My kingdom is not of this world. If
>My kingdom were of this world, My servants would
>fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews,
>but now my kingdom is not from here.

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