"Pinyin" wa "Ch, sh, gh, ng, zh, q, x" larning siri -- Uyghur Latin Yeziqi

[ Show ]

Support VoyForums

[ Shrink ]

VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

12/30/24 19:17:05 [ Login ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, [9], 10 ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: 07/12/01 21:28:49
Author: Waris
Subject: "Pinyin" wa "Ch, sh, gh, ng, zh, q, x" larning siri

From: waris
Date: Sat Nov 18, 2000 3:57 am
Subject: "Pinyin" wa "Ch, sh, gh, ng, zh, q, x" larning siri

�ssalumu �l�ykum tordashlar w� Ray �p�ndim qatarliq "ch", "sh", "zh", "Pinyin" largha kongul b�lg�chil�r,

M�n Zamangh w� yighin qatnashquchilirigha wakalit�n UKY ni mulahiz� qiliwatqat barliq tordashlargha r�hm�t etymon.

"Pinyin Asasidiki Uyghur Yeziqi" dike "Pinyin" deg�n s�z heroism huquqi Pinyin ni k�rs�tm�ydu! Uning bir qalpaq ik�nlikini UKY elipb�sidin bir qarapla k�r�welish mumkin. Qalpaq qish k�nliri beshimizni issiq saqlisa, yaz k�nliri boranning chechimizni uchurup ketishidin saqlaydu, �jdatlirimiz burundinla beshigha bir n�rs� kiyip k�lg�n. "Pinyin" dig�n s�zni Profisur Mijit Xudab�rdi �p�ndi qatarliq pishq�d�ml�r h�diy� qilghan. U s�zning paydisi biz bu yeziqni --UKY h�k�m�tk� sunghanda tigidu. Miningch� k�pchilik �mdi ch�sh�ndi.

UKY= 82%(IPA) + 15%(X�lqning k�ngini) + 3%(X�tning g�z�lliki)

IPA(X�lqaraliq transkripsiy�) --> ... q,sh, x ...
X�lqning k�n�p k�tkini --> j, y, gh, ng, w
Qolyazmining g�z�lliki --> Zh (y�ni qoshma h�rpl�rning "h" bil�n axirlashqan bird�klikini s�qlash)

Ch --> qolsh h�rp bopqalghini bil�n nurghun tillarda h�m IPA dimu [ʧ]("ch") d�p t�lappuz qilinidu. Biz k�pchilik(bolupmu Ray �pandim) otturgha qoyghan pikirni birinchi h�m ikkinchi qetimliq yighinda otturgha qoyghan. "C" h�rpining qisqa bolusht�k artuqchiliqini nurghun kishil�r yaxshi k�rg�n bolsimu, lekin "C" IPA da [ʤ]("j"), tining oxshimasliqigha qarap [ʧ],[k],[s],[ʁ]... deg�nd�k qilinghachqa, omumiy principning oqushqa h�m IPA g� uyghun bolush deg�n maddisigha asas�n, y�nila "ch" tallandi. Bundaq qilghanda uyghurch� uqmaydighan mutlaq k�p sandiki kishil�rmu uyghurch� oquyalaydik�n d�p bikitilg�n. "Ch" X�nzuch�, Inglizch�, Uzbekch�, Kurdch�, �z�rb�yjnach� ... dimu [ʧ] d�p oqilidu. Buni 10 n�chch� tilshunas birlikt� k�p mulahiz� qilghan.

Sh --> Qoshma h�rp, IPA da h�m nurghn tillarda [ʃ]("sh") d�p t�l�ppuz qilinidu. Tilshunaslar "sh" ni "x" d�p elishnimu "ch" ni "c" d�p elishqa oxshash nurghun muzakir� qilinghan.

Sh(Sham)--> X(Xam)
X(Xoraz)--> H(Horaz)
H(Halal)--> ? (�g�r "h" ni ishl�ts�k tilshunasliq qa'idisidiki "bir fonimagha bir h�rip" prinsipigha ch�shm�ydu...)

Lekin axirida tilshunaslar y�nila "sh" ni tallindi.

Gh, ng --> X�lq k�n�p k�tk�n

Zh--> Bu h�rp Uyghur tilida intayin az ishlitilg�chk�(b�sh alt� orundila) h�m "z" bil�n "h" ning arqimu arqa kelish pursiti yoq diy�rlik(�z'hal din bashqa, �g�r y�n� k�pchilik bayqighan bolsa �w�rtip b�rs�) bolghachqa x�tning g�z�lliki("h" bil�n axirlashturush) k�zd� tutulup, "Dj", "Zj","vj", " j " larni qollinish mywapiq d�p qaralmidi.

Q--> X�lqarada omumiyliship bolghan h�m uyghurlarning �ng chong tor bikiti http://www.makanim.com mu alliburun omomiylashturup bolghan. Masil�n: Iraq, Quran ...
X--> G�rch� Uyghur x�lqi arisida k�ng omumiylashqan bosimu, lekin IPA gha uyghun k�lm�slik, uyghurlar x�nzulardin bashqilar "x" ni "sh" d�p t�l�ppuz qilishqa k�n�lmig�chk�, tilshunaslar t�ripidin "Xoraz" diki "x" �ch�n taliwelindi.

Uyghur-->Bu atalghu yighinda birlikk� kelip boghan!!! H�m yighinda bundin keyin "Uighur", "Uygur", "Uigur", "Weiwuerzu" dig�nd�k yezilsa imla xataliqi d�p alahid� k�rsitilg�n.
�nggiliy�likl�r jahilliq qilip Oxford lughitid� "Uighur" d�p yazghan bosimu, Amerika qatarliq d�l�tl�r Uyghurlar gha h�rm�t qilip "Uyghur" d�p yazghan. Buni Amerikada uqup k�lg�n tilshunas Doktur X�mit Zakir �p�ndi alahid� t�kitlig�n. Oxford lughitinimu �zg�rtidighanlar chiqip qalar ...
Shunga Alimjan qatarliq "Uighur" ning yaqlighuchilirining tilshunaslargha h�m yighinning qararigha h�rm�t qilishini s�mimiy t�l�p qilim�n.

Rey �p�ndim, sizning "Zh" ni " j ", "Zj" gha �zg�rtish pikiringiz burunla tilshunaslar t�ripidin r�t qilinghan. Miningch� "J" q�t'iy mukin �m�s, lekin "Z" ning arqisidin "h" kilidighan s�zl�r k�p chiqip qalsa, "Zj" ni qayta qarap chiqishqa sunushqa bolidu. Buning �ch�n siz "z" ning arqisidin "h" kilidighan s�zl�rdin k�pr�k tepip birishingizni soraym�n. M�n Shinjang Uniwersititigha wakal�t�n bu pikirni qayta sunup baqsam solidu.
Sizning q�lqara birlikl�r toghrisidiki pikiringiz xeli orunluqk�n. Qarisam siz xeli chongqur izliniwetipsiz. Shunga q�lqara birlikl�r t�r�ptin y�nimu eniqraq pikir b�rsingz. "c", "v" larni "ch","W" lar �ch�n ishl�tm�y ch�ttin kirg�n s�zl�rg� ishl�ts�k qandaq bolar? chunki cm/sec ni chm/sech yaki chm/sec d�p oqughili bolmaydu. "v" nimu xeli yaxshi oylishipsiz.

Biz "C" ni bird�m [s], bird�m "ch" d�p oqusaq kishil�rni qaymuqturup qoyimiz. Shunga "ch" ni "c" gha �zg�rtm�y, uni ch�ttin kirg�t atalghulargha ishlitish yaki ishl�tm�slikni oylashsaq.

Biz KUY ni xeli t�st� mushunchilik birlikk� k�lt�rduq. Buninga 10 n�chch� ataqliq tilshunas qatnashqan. Nurghun kishil�r "Bu uyghurlarning tunji qetim birlikk� kelishi ..." d�p qaridi.
Shunga k�pchilikning �shu 10 n�chch� tilshunasning pikirig� h�rm�t qilishini, tilshunasliq sah�sidin izlinip pikir birishini soraymiz...

Miningch� "Ch, gh, ng, sh, q, x" larni �mdi qayta oylashmishaq, "Zh" gha m�n dig�n boyich� oylashsaq qandaq?

Ch�nki bundaq qiliw�rs�k birlikimiz buzulup k�tmisun, x�lqnimu qaymuqturmayli. Birlikk� kelip 3 k�n ichid� bazi kishil�r UKY-1, UKY-2 deg�nd� "Birlik" l�rni chiqirip boptu. http://www.uighursoft.com/Uyghurqe/index.htm g� qarang.

"h" ni "c" dis�, "q" ni "Kh" dis� ... Bular q�y�rdiki tilshunasning qa'idisig� ch�shidu? Kiml�r birlikk� k�lt�rg�n!? D�l shu kishi 14 - dikabir m�n (Waris Abdukerim) ning yenida olturup "Yengi UKY layih�sig� qoshulim�n ..." d�p xeli yuquri awazda warqirighan!!! Uighursoft sherkitining derictory bolghan bu kishi (Alim �h�t) ning yeghin xulasisining pikir d�ptirig� yezilghan birdinbir pikiri " Elipb� t�rtipi kona yeziq t�rtipi boyich� bolsun."(Imzasi h�m pikiri Kona yeziqta yezilghan) idi. Bu qandaq w�d�?! Bu qandaq birlik!!!???

�mdi m�rkizi m�sil� y�nila UKY ning elipb� t�rtipi bil�n "c", "w" larni ch�ttin kirg�n s�zl�rg�, birlikl�rg� ishlitish yaki ishl�tm�slikk� y�tk�ls� qand�q?

Zaman Research Group
Xinjiang University
Urumqi, China
Email: waris@xju.edu.cn
http://www.zaman.xju.edu.cn
Tel:86-991-2862753-5234(O),5146(H)

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Forum timezone: GMT+2
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums^(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.