Is Chicago UBF a cult? -- RSQUBF Discussion Boards 2001 highlights

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Date Posted: 11:25:48 01/09/02 Wed
Author: multiple
Subject: Is Chicago UBF a cult?
In reply to: rsqarchive 's message, "January 2001" on 10:32:30 01/09/02 Wed

Author: ubfer
Subject: Is Chicago UBF a cult?

I will not say if Chicago UBF is a cult or not. However, there seem to be some pretty standard indicators among Christian groups that help people to decide for themselves. Look at these points and then decide for yourself...

By Rick Ross, Expert Consultant and Intervention Specialist

Ten warning signs of a potentially unsafe group/leader.

1.Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.

2.No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.

3.No meaningful financial

4.disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.

5. Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.

6. There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.

7.Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.

8.There are records, books, news
articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.

9.Followers feel they can never be "good enough".

10.The group/leader is always right.

11.The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing "truth" or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable or credible.

Ten warning signs regarding people involved in/with a potentially unsafe group/leader.

1.Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.

2.Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred. Instead, in the follower's mind these identities become substantially and increasingly fused--as that person's involvement with the group/leader continues and deepens.

3.Whenever the group/leader is criticized or questioned it is characterized as "persecution".

4.Uncharacteristically stilted and
seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.

5.Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independently or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.

6.Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supersede any personal goals or individual interests.

7.A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.

8.Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.

10.Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.

11.Former followers are at best-considered negative or worse evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.

Ten signs of a safe group/leader.
A safe group/leader will answer your questions without becoming judgmental and
punitive.

1.A safe group/leader will disclose information such as finances and often offer an independently audited financial statement regarding budget and expenses. Safe groups and leaders will tell you more than you want to know.

2.A safe group/leader is often democratic, sharing decision making and encouraging accountability and oversight.

3.A safe group/leader may have disgruntled former followers, but will not vilify, excommunicate and forbid others from associating with them.

4.A safe group/leader will not have a paper trail of overwhelmingly negative records, books, articles and statements about them.

5.A safe group/leader will encourage family communication, community interaction and existing friendships and not feel threatened.

6.A safe group/leader will recognize reasonable boundaries and limitations when dealing with others.

7.A safe group/leader will encourage critical thinking, individual autonomy and feelings of self-esteem.

8.A
safe group/leader will admit failings and mistakes and accept constructive criticism and advice.

9.A safe group/leader will not be the only source of knowledge and learning excluding everyone else, but value dialogue and the free exchange of ideas.

Don't be naïve, develop a good BS Detector.
You can protect yourself from unsafe groups and leaders by developing a good BS detector. Check things out, know the facts and examine the evidence. A safe group will be patient with your decision making process. If a group or leader grows angry and anxious just because you want to make an informed and careful decision before joining; beware.

Copyright © Rick Ross

Author: Tony
Subject: Re: Is Chicago UBF a cult?

I think Rick Ross has hit the nail on the head. I can't believe the similarities between what he says and UBF, they are almost exactly the same.

People, if you are hurting, please find a healthy church like the one described above. And remember when you start looking for a church seek the Lord's leading, and don't look for another church like UBF such as the ICOC.

If you are not hurting and want to change UBF please, please, serve the Lord by pushing these issues and make UBF a healthy place for students!

Prayer: "Lord, open their eyes that they may see, and ears that they may hear. Please intervene and let this evil no longer persist. Amen"

Author: freebird
Subject: Re: Is Chicago UBF a cult?

Okay. Let me spell it out. Chicago UBF is a cult. Samuel Lee is a cult leader. And a very good one, I might add. If you study totalitarian leaders such as Mao, Castro, Stalin, Kim Il Sung, Hitler, etc., you will see the similarities between Samuel Lee and each of these leaders. I don't think Samuel Lee started out to be a cult leader. I think he genuinely wanted to serve God. Unfortunately, his own past unresolved hurts opened him up to be a prime candidate for giving in to the temptation of becoming a totalitarian cult figure.

I'm not for condemning UBF. That's Satan's job. However, I am for speaking the truth. I think that we need to extend love and compassion to everyone, in and out of UBF, including to Samuel Lee, who's in grave danger of God's judgment. Believe me, if Samuel Lee has done even a quarter of what is being revealed (and I know for a fact that at least a quarter did happen), Samuel Lee's going to need a lot of compassion. If he truly repents, God will extend mercy just as
he extends mercy to me moment by moment, but he will still have to suffer the consequences of his sin, be they jail time for IRS violations, jail time for abuse or accessory to manslaughter, jail time for stealing a passport, civil suits of various kinds...the consequences could be many if a few people were to really get mad and actually do something about it.

Others who were his right and left hands will not get off all that easy either, I'm afraid. People like Sarah Barry, Samuel Lee's children may also have to suffer the consequences, not because their motives were evil (at least Sarah Barry and Grace aren't, I can't speak for Little Sarah or Sam Jr), but just because they chose to be silent and passive. I am especially sad for Sarah Barry who devoted her entire life to ministering to Koreans and college students. She loves the Lord, I know, and I just pray that if it takes for the Holy Spirit to come upon her like Pentecost and to reveal to her explicitly what God thinks about all this, that he
would go right ahead and do that. Maybe the audible voice of God will wake somebody up. It seems like nothing else will

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supplementary worship service tomorrow -- multiple, 11:27:14 01/09/02 Wed