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Date Posted: 23:21:04 06/30/05 Thu
Author: all
Subject: responses
In reply to: Araninda 's message, "Episode of the Week. . .Jagathon. . .Inside" on 23:09:43 06/30/05 Thu

A 4. As for telling Mac about Renee leaving...Mac rejected Harm on the aircraft carrier...walked out on their conversation. I doubt he was ready to "put himself out there again". (NT) -- psych9, 21:51:21 06/24/05 Fri

Mac didn't reject Harm on the carrier. She asked him if he was willing to give up his girlfriend to have her. He had to think about it, which was rather strange to say the least. She didn't hear him say "yes." (NT) -- Cece, 22:37:32 06/24/05 Fri

But she refused to continue their conversation later on the ship...made a rather snide comment as I recall. (NT) -- psych9, 22:42:27 06/24/05 Fri

I think in her mind, he still wanted to keep Renee around, so there was no point in talking. There is no doubt that she was distressed about it, as was he. When Harm left, their facial expressions were heartbreaking. It was again, a matter of misunderstanding. At the race, some of that came to a head, and they agreed to start again. (NT) -- Cece, 23:02:05 06/24/05 Fri

Harm should never have gone to see Mac until he was "ready" to talk. He had to think about whether or not he'd give up Renee in order to have Mac - why? Wasn't he sure? Did he still want Renee? I don't blame Mac for walking out. I'd have walked out, too. And if I weren't on a ship, I'd have left town - again. Harm had no business even approaching Mac until he was able to talk, and it was obvious he was only looking for answers to his questions, not a mature grown-up discussion. (NT) -- NanaSue, 18:23:48 06/26/05 Sun

Mac wasn't ready to hear anything either, She was still demanding Harm give up things for her. Too bad she wasn't mature or grown-up enough to have the conversation either. (NT) -- G, 19:08:28 06/26/05 Sun

I know. Talk about nerve. I don't know why she ever asked him those questions. But then, she had told him she'd let him know when she was ready to talk and he just couldn't wait. It was just another way of breaking them apart. Too bad. (NT) -- NS, 22:58:27 06/26/05 Sun

I give it a 4.5. I think that Harm was trying to deny his feelings toward Mac as well as she was denying her's toward Harm. Sturgis saw right through them and realized that there was something there. I think the "Back to the beginning" comment just meant that they both were willing to try over to be friends first. (NT) -- Martian Barb hoping that I made sense!, 22:11:48 06/24/05 Fri

Back to the beginning - broke my shipper heart. I had soo much hope until then. To me it all began to turn kind of sour - after JAGATHON - I even blamed 911. Jagathon was my LAST really favorite episode. I enjoyed some of the others but not like I had enjoyed the previous years. (NT) -- can j, 22:20:26 06/24/05 Fri

I loved the episodes that came after Jagathon. We got episodes like Tribunal, In Country, and Critical Condition. I felt they were starting over and the rest of S7 showed that and had H/M getting close again. Also saw everyone in JAG getting along well. What I hate is the slow decline in S8. S7 is one of my favorite seasons. (NT) -- Hope, 22:40:21 06/24/05 Fri

At the time, I was really optomistic about the new beginning. I thought that even showing the four friends running together, was a turning point for them all. It was also symbolic of the way Americans banded together after 9/11, which is what the JAGathon was all about. I could see how H and M had come to a standstill, and neither knew how to move forward. They had to clear out the old, and start anew. It didn't work out that way, but at the time, I felt wonderful about it. (NT) -- Cece, 22:35:43 06/24/05 Fri

2) Actually, he said "or wish they were" I believe. He was throwing off a few comments to relieve frustration. It wasn't nice, but like most of us, he said something that was not meant for her ears. I think there was part of him who wanted to be her boyfriend and was a bit jealous of the men she'd been with. It sounded to me like a bit of bravado said by one guy to a friend. I'm not making excuses. Harm and Mac have both said stupid stuff. (NT) -- Cece, 22:41:12 06/24/05 Fri

Amen to that! (NT) -- psych9, 22:43:39 06/24/05 Fri

He says "feel like they are." which I don't think is as bad as "wish they were."....lol. (NT) -- manette, 23:29:27 06/24/05 Fri

Was the timeline or continuity of this episode off, or was it shown out of sequence? I'm asking because H&M don't seem to be on friendly terms through most of this episode, yet the previous episode to this was "Redemption" where he comes to her apartment & we get the line about bad coffee & catching her in her pajamas. (NT) -- Araninda, 22:56:58 06/24/05 Fri

Yes, one of the episodes was shown out of order. I remember the discussion at the time. (NT) -- Cece, 22:59:44 06/24/05 Fri

I looked and Redemption has a production number of 142 and Jagathon is 141. But Redemption aired two episodes before Jagathon. Ambush was between them. (NT) -- Hope, 23:03:24 06/24/05 Fri

Wasn't it because they wanted to hold Jagathon for sweeps? (NT) -- manette, 23:06:47 06/24/05 Fri

Loved that Harm ripped the sleeves from his t-shirt. AJ has great legs. Did Harriett have on a wig? I never noticed how pretty Singer was until I looked at Hope's pictures. Guess I never paid attention. Harm's facial expressions were priceless. (NT) -- Angela S, 23:08:09 06/24/05 Fri

Mac's line about she couldn't understand why they couldn't make it work will come back again in Fair Winds - not the exact words, but the meaning. (NT) -- Araninda, 23:24:31 06/24/05 Fri

I love Jagathon. I give it a 5. I love the way it's constructed-- the way it weaves back and forth from the race day to the day before. And this is the Harm and Mac I enjoy watching--pushing at each other, competitive--challenging each other. I mean this was UST at its finest.When Harm tells Mac-'I don't want to compete with you anymore' and the next scene has him sending a message through Harriet to 'enjoy your lead because soon you'll be eating my dust,' makes my heart sing. Him giving her the extra 3 minute lead-and being so macho and cocky about it. I love it. Ohh and the scene where he barges into her office after finding out from the Admiral that she's been training..lol. The look he gives her before he leaves and closes her door. And can I say I get shivers when he says "I saw your face, Colonel. You were sold." Yikes! I loved the back to the beginning and was relieved that it didn't end with Harm saying -the end, I guess... I would have been screaming. We had a lot of positive shipper movement after this-- Answered Prayers, The Mission, Tribunal, In Country, Enemy Below--on into the next season with Critical Condition--all the way through to the let's hide the pregnancy episodes. I also loved Tiner and Gunny in this one. I just thought it was a very cleverly written episode.(NT)--manette, 23:27:19 06/24/05 Fri

I agree. This ep made me laugh and also get quite emotional. The "competition" remark, is interesting, because it was part of their relationship. I find it interesting now, that they came in at the end, in a photo finish. It now reminds me of the coin toss where we don't know who won. I believe we were always supposed to see H and M as equally in love, equally friends. (NT) -- Cece, 00:04:12 06/25/05 Sat

I like the ep. give it 4 and agree with other post here but I think Harm was so cruel to Mac with that comment. I know that he said that to Sturgis and He was feeling traped to Sturgis comment and he was sad because they couldn't work their relationship in Guadalcanal, but he was resposible for Mac pain in that matter.(NT)--Gra, 00:51:57 06/25/05 Sat

Out of 5 Im giving it a 4. It was entertaining and Harm,Mac,Tiner,Gunny. AJ made me laugh which was rare in Jag for so long.Ofcourse this was another disappointing episode in the end because its the yoyo stunt for the H-M fans AGAIN.It was hyped up by ET and many thought its the ep.fans have been waiting for between H-M but our dreams were never realized. The yoyo from TPTB was really getting to me and my friends. H-M were adorable and their loving sparks all aglow. (NT) -- NevadaGH, 01:22:56 06/25/05 Sat

i give it a 4.5 this is one of my fave�s. so much Harm and so much H&M i never get tired of the frustration i get from this ep..first time i caught myself yelling at the TV when Harm and Sturgis are talking in front of the elevator and all those looks just so priceless (NT) -- davi i LOVE season 7 so much hope but still no satisfaction on the H&M part...i guess i love to torture myself *grin*, 02:33:43 06/25/05 Sat

I rate it a 4. I liked it...it waas a great showcase of all of the cast , they were still 'them' if you know what I mean.(smile) @) I'm not really sure what Harm meant by that...it hurt to hear, another wedge to keep them apart, at the time it didnt make sense to me.3) It was where they were at the time. Harm behind the wall and Mac still hurting from the mistake with Mic and her life as it was. 4)I dont really agree with Sturgis, they always got the job done irregardless of what was going on with them personally. It was just stiff necked Sturgis. 5)I think Harm did say something about 'I figured it was too late to make any difference'..or something like that. 6)I took it to mean that Mac wanted to start over from the beginning. Maybe they werent ready for a relationship yet, but it could have meant'lets start over and see what happens'(I had so much hope back then)(NT)---- mkim, 02:52:41 06/25/05 Sat

1. 5, one of the best. 2. Sometimes the truth will surface. Think he felt like this, but never meant for her to hear it. (Frustration) 3. Mac always took things more personally. 4. The only one being sucked in was Sturgis. 5. No. Think he just thought there was no reason to discuss it. How many guys would? 6. Presumably, she meant to start over. (NT) -- Carol R, 03:23:28 06/25/05 Sat

4.75. This is one of my favorites. It is clever and funny. As far as question #4, thier relationship IS like a vacuum, sucking up everything and everyone in its path--I know I was sucked in! LOL! #3: Of course Mac took things more personally than Harm--she is a woman! LOL! J/K. Seriously, in the past, SHE had been the one who had been more open about how she felt (Goodbyes, Boomerang) and therefore, she had been the one who had taken the "rejection" more personally. #5: I think Harm wasn't sure how to tell Mac that Renee dumped him because of what she had asked him earlier (Are you willing to give up your girlfriend for me?) The fact that Renee dumped *him* instead of the other way around took away his ability to prove to Mac that he would give her up. For all we know he could have been planning to dump Renee as soon as he felt it would be appropriate (after she had had time to grieve for her father). #6: I think that Mac was suggesting they start over with a clean slate, forgetting all the missed opportunities and painful memories. She was offering him a second chance to get things right without pushing him too fast.(NT)---- JAG Junkie--just got back from a family reunion so I am checking in here late, 22:24:19 06/25/05 Sat

"Jagathon" just confirmed the end of my shipperdom. I expected something more - like adult conversation. And my patience was gone. Harm broke my heart with that comment. It sounded like something Singer would say - or something Harm would say about Singer. Whether or not his emotions were involved didn't matter. Baby Harm just would never be ready for a real adult relationship. Others saw it differently, but that's what I took from the episode. After 6 seasons, a few seconds a year just didn't do it for me anymore. (NT) -- NanaSue...really enjoyed most of Jagathon, but the H&M stuff just turned me off., 18:36:49 06/26/05 Sun

As far as Harm not telling Mac about Renee I think it was partly a mocho thing with him, not wanting her to know Renee left him but I also think it was because of the way things were left on the ship. Why should he tell her. Also, Harm could be very cruel with words at times. Sort of like "you only hurt the one you love". I think you tend to lash out the the ones you love the most to keep them from hurting you. Just a theory. (NT) -- JBgirlygirl, 09:47:58 06/27/05 Mon

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