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Date Posted: 19/02/03 15:45:58 GMT+10
Author: Goktimus Prime
Subject: Re: Mini-Con origins
In reply to: The Scarlet Scorpion 's message, "Re: Mini-Con origins" on 18/02/03 1:22:55 GMT+10

>
>I believe the late Martin Niemoeller, a pastor for the
>German Evangelical (Lutheran) Church, said it best:
>
>"In Germany, the Nazis first came for the Communists,
>and I did not speak up, because I was not a Communist.
>Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak up,
>because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the trade
>unionists, and I did not speak up, because I was not a
>trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and
>I did not speak up, because I was not a Catholic. Then
>they came for me... and by that time, there was no one
>to speak up for anyone."
>
>E tu, Cybertron?
>

I like that analogy. Btw, the Latin word for and is "et" not "e". :)

>
>
>On a side note, just what is it that makes
>people hate Nightscream so much? I mean, if you
>saw you family get slaughtered right in front of your
>face, wouldn't you be more than a bit angsty?
>If you don't believe me, one of my friends from school
>is from Bosnia; his father was killed there, his
>brother was nearly blown up by a landmine, and he
>himself has a large, jagged scar running across his
>left cheek. He's certainly not that fond of his
>childhood memoies of the Old Country, no sir. Anyhoo,
>back to the original topic...
>

I think what a lot of people have against Nightscream is that he doesn't ever quite get over it. Yes, he had a horrific time as a refugee after the Vehicon invasion, but after becoming a resistance fighter, it's high time he just got over it. That's not to say he should forget what happened to him, but that he should have learnt to cope with his angst, accept what has happened to him and move on with defeating the Vehicons. In G1, Bluestreak was also a refugee after his home town was utterly decimated by Decepticons. But rather than becoming an angsty brooding git about it, he developed a dry and cutting sense of sarcastic wit to deal with his pain.

Personally I don't hate Nightscream. I thought he was a more believable character than Silverbolt who REALLY took too long to get over himself.

>The Armada cartoon, on the other hand, isn't
>just crap for all the obvious reasons (poor dub job,
>low-budget animation, continuity gaffs, etc.),

I actually watched the first episode of Micron Densetsu yesterday and the lip sync matched!! This further confirms my theory that Armada was originally scripted in Japanese and that the animators were working off the Japanese script in terms of lip animation. And so far they haven't made any gross scripting mistakes as they had in the Armada dub.

Does anyone else hate the fact that Optimus and Megatron refer to their troops as "men"? MEN?! WTF? They're robots! They *never* call themselves "men"... wrong species, drongo!

>but
>because it shows the Autobots as self-rightious
>hypocrites. Optimus has shown that he doesn't consider
>the Mini-Cons to be overly intelligent (remember how
>surprised he was when they used his trailer's weapons
>in one episode?), and "protects" them in a manner
>similar to the U.S. protecting Kuwait in the Gulf War,
>i.e. he'll help them out only because they're of use
>to him, and look good doing it (I am in no way saying
>I like Saddam Hussein, I'm just saying the U.S.
>wouldn't have thought twice about it if Kuwait wasn't
>a member of OPEC). Whether or not Optimus will go back
>into a state of apathy after the end of the war with
>the Decepticons, I do not know.
>

Good point.

>
>
>Uh, what was the Inshin Rebellion (this is why I'm
>taking a course on "China and the Pacific Rim" next
>year at high school)? I assume it happened in Japan,
>but that's all I know.
>

Ishin Rebellion -- re: Meiji Restoration/Revolution (1860s)
Ishin rebels overthrow the Tokugawa Shogunate and restore Emperor Meiji to his throne. Japan opens herself up to the rest of the world again for the first time in two hundred years and establishes foreign trade, thrusting Japan into the Industrial Revolution.

>
>
>Personally, I believe the cartoon MCs are
>rational (in the normal Cybertronian sense), for even
>though they are a horrendously passive race, they can
>and will defend themselves (well, if others can't do
>it for them, at least...). Also, just because
>something doesn't communicate in a typical human
>fashion does not make it any less sentient (dolphins,
>octopus, etc.).
>
>If you want a more human comparison, how about the
>blind and deaf (or "visually impared" and "hearing
>impared", if you prefer...)?
>
>It's just a different language, that's all.

Minicons: sentient, yes. Rational? ...I'm yet to be convinced as far as the cartoon goes. Then again I've only seen a few episodes. As for the language thing, that's difficult to cite as evidence since we don't understand what they're saying. But I suppose the fact that the kids understand what they say could be used to argue that the Mini-cons' language is advanced, demonstrating that the Minicons are rational agents (much like how Chewbacca was never subtitled, but the fact that other characters understood him and reacted with his speech demonstrated that he was using advanced/complex language and that he was an intelligent and rational creature).

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