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Date Posted: 12:01:24 01/09/02 Wed
Author: multiple
Subject: Reflection of a "Second-Gen" & the Cali Raisin controversy (continued)
In reply to: multiple 's message, "Reflection of a "Second-Gen" & the Cali Raisin controversy" on 11:58:11 01/09/02 Wed

Author: Cali Raisin
Subject: weird

At first, I didnt know what you guys were talking about, so I did a little catch up. 2nd Gen Pen does sound like me, but I don't have that "I don't care" attitude. And from what I can tell, he or she still lives in Chicago, while I, on the other hand, live in...you guessed it, California That's the only detail you're getting out of me. So let's not speculate my identity anymore, that's just wrong. And I don't see why everyone is attacking me, my motives for asking Ruth about such a stupid rumor were pure and innocent. One thing that I do agree with 2nd Gen Pen about is that since you guys don't know me, you shouldn't judge me. So no more attacking Cali Raisin.

Author: Cali Raisin
Subject: Re: Rumors and Its responses: Surrounding Ruth's Testimony

You're right, but please understand that I seriously thought that I was doing some good by putting the rumor out in the open so that she could deny it and so that everyone else that heard the rumor could see the truth also. I never meant to offend anyone.

Author: ubf person
Subject: Re: Rumors and Its responses: Surrounding Ruth's Testimony

You are right,UBF is a shame based church. Right away when I brought up the Reform movement issue in our church my credibility was immediately attacked within a matter of minutes. The same is true of others who have left or who have questions.

EVERYONE who leaves UBF or who questions it has something TERRIBLY wrong with him or her. Either they are proud, rebellious, unbelieving, lazy, or they have unsolved sin problems. I do not want to belong to a church like that. I want to be with believers who are willing to seek answers to tough questions without seeking to shame those who ask them.

Author: Cali Raisin
Subject: Re: The migratory patterns of rumors

You might be right. the rumor could have just got weirder and weirder as people passed it along. it's strange that no one has heard that rumor in chicago, the person that told me said he heard it from someone in chicago. but this is all stupid. i told ruth that i was sorry. i didnt mean to cause all this trouble. i seriously thought i was doing a good thing by giving her a chance to deny it in public.

Author: 2ndGenPen "The Legend"
Subject: Return of the Legend

Wow, I didn't know that I was so famous. Cali Raisin should be flattered that he/she is being compared to a legend such as myself. I guess first I should thank my fans, the Anonymous sisters, and all the other little people who I stepped on to get here. Hugs and kisses.

Author: Reform Issue Kim
Subject: Re: Play nice Ruth

Dear Cali,

Ruth's comments have a very important reform issue in them. It is manipulation by a rumor mill in UBF. Of course, in America too, politicians use the tactic of a trial baloon in order to test people's oppinion. But if UBF, especially in Chicago UBF and UBF chapters whose leaders strongly immitate Bogus Dr. Samuel Lee (Please read www.reformubf.org for detailed reasearch about samuel lee's bogus doctoral degree), the degree of harm is very serious. Character assasinations are often executed by clever and vicious rumors or double talkings. In my decades of UBF life, I learned the importance of journalism's dictum, "Listen to both sides of stories. Do not just listen to one side story and then make a decision." As Ruth mentioned, information is tightly controlled. I will write about this issue later. God be with you and protect you.

Author: Reform Issue Kim
Subject: Re: I heard it through the grapevine

Dear Ruthy Chung,

I am so thankful to God that He has
protected you from unbearably painful experiences in Chicago UBF and also from Satan's temptation of suicide. I am doubly thankful to God that He has formed a Christlike character in you through many sufferings when you have kept your faith in the lord. I am sorry that I did not know anything about your suffering in Chicago UBF. I appreciate you for your speaking up. "One who flew over a cookoo's nest" should be told and shown so that others may be protected and the tightly controlled cookoo's nest may be reformed. Thank you again, Ruthy. I would like to call you "Little Ruthy" but I repent of my such desires for those may sound condescending. My point is that I am very, very proud of you for your faith, courage and humility. Happy Christian millennium to you. How thankful we are that you are alive, alive well in Christ. May God protect many second gens.

Author: Sarah Rhee
Subject: Re: Rumors and Its responses: Surrounding Ruth's Testimony

Dear Cali,

I believe you that you did not intend to offend in your question to Ruth. This is the downside to communicating behind keyboards and monitors instead of face-to-face...we can't read the nonverbal cues that would give us a hint to the communicator's sincerity or intention. Although I think it was not the most tactful thing of you to post that question to Ruth (it was what communication majors and interviewers call a "loaded question"), I think you've been chastised enough and have gotten the message. Having read your posts, however, I know that you will not be discouraged from continuing to post and speaking freely on this forum. I encourage you to seek the truth.

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