Create a New Forum Admin Login Member Login Contribute to Voyager Search VoyForums Help Desk VoyForums Exchange VoyForums Directory/Categories VoyForums Homepage VoyForums News FAQ - Frequently Asked Questions

[ Show ]

Support VoyForums

[ Shrink ]

VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1 ]

Subject: Re: dowsing Author: Eleanor [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 20/11/02 19:08:29 Author Host/IP: webcacheB10a.cache.pol.co.uk/195.92.168.172 In reply to: The Druid 's message, "Re: dowsing" on 20/11/02 16:33:10 >Hi Druid >So, what your saying is that blind people cant be >dowsers??? A blind person would have their other senses heightened and would probably make very good Dowsers with rods. However you do need to see a crystal in order to read its answer. >Since there is absolutely No scientific evidence that >dowsing works how do you rule out involuntary movement >of the hand whether you can see the crystal or not. >This is known as the Ideometer Effect. >William Carpenter in 1852 argued that muscular >movement can be initiated by the mind independently of >volition or emotions. We may not be aware of it, but >suggestions can be made to the mind by others or by >observations. Those suggestions can influence the mind >and affect motor behaviour. >Scientific tests by American psychologist William >James, French chemist Michel Chevreul, English >scientist Michael Faraday, and American psychologist >Ray Hyman have demonstrated that many phenomena >attributed to spiritual or paranormal forces, or to >mysterious "energies," are actually due to ideomotor >action. Furthermore, these tests demonstrate that >"honest, intelligent people can unconsciously engage >in muscular activity that is consistent with their >expectations". They also show that suggestions that >can guide behaviour can be given by subtle clues. So, once again, you need to be able to see the crystal to counteract any involuntary movement. >All that would be needed here is to instruct the >witness to how the crystal will respond, circular for >yes, side to side for no etc. Even the basic answers of yes or no are different for individual dowsers. Would you rather we leave it to the interpretation of the witness who may just end up making a wild guess? I am certain that this would be even less accurate particularly as the witnesses may have helped compile the questions in the first place. >At least we agree on something. Good >What are you saying here?? Its nothing to do with >'spirits' but that your crystal possesses an >intelligence of its own? No. What I am saying is that if there is anything to communicate with it would be rude not to acknowledge them whilst talking to them. >The problem with 'crystal' dowsing and any other >method that relies on a yes/no answering system is >that everybody can achieve a 50% success rate. > >Given that the odds using this method are pretty much >50/50 why do the calculations regarding the Derby Gaol >experiment fail to take into consideration what >percentage of answers could have been predicted by >‘chance’? This is why we never use a single Dowser who could be making up anything. At least with a crystal there is some visible sign of an answer if only an involuntary movement, unlike a Medium who may just feel something and cannot work in tandem with another Medium. Regards Eleanor [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

Subject Author Date Re: dowsing John 20/11/02 22:38:57 Re: dowsing -- The Druid, 22/11/02 16:09:05 Re: dowsing The Druid 22/11/02 15:48:28 Re: dowsing -- Eleanor, 22/11/02 21:01:03 Re: dowsing -- The Druid, 25/11/02 2:06:06 Re: dowsing -- John, 22/11/02 21:13:06