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Friday, May 08, 08:12:59pm [ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, [2], 3 ]

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Date Posted: Monday, March 01, 07:43:05pm
Author: RW
Author Host/IP: cust-107.db3broadband.com / 216.177.117.107
Subject: Trolls
In reply to: ST 's message, "Re: Kudos" on Monday, March 01, 07:24:47am

ST, perhaps you approach the messageboard medium in a way different than most people. I get the impression that, for you, the messageboard is solely a forum for debate and discussion of issues. And sure, that certainly is one use for it. But is that the only reason Rants & Raves exists?

The answer is clearly no. Messageboards don't only serve that purpose. People use messageboards to have fun, to banter, to kibitz, to "flame", to let off steam. And given the name "Rants and Raves", all these things are apropos. So, unless you go to a board where all activities aside from strict debate are expressly forbidden, you should participate with the knowledge that you are going to be exposed to all of these things, and even potentially be a target of them. That goes with the territory.

So, even if we assume that your label of "troll" is correct for Queer and Dash (which it is not), their troll status is neither here nor there. If someone wants to post messages that rile people and get them up in arms, why not? Why is that off limits? The answer is, of course, it isn't. You seem to be under the impression that deliberately antagonizing another person for the sole purpose of watching them react is taboo. It's not, ST. That's part of the gig on messageboards where people are allowed to interact freely. It can be fun, especially when the target is hypersenstive, or isn't well liked or seems to deserve it. Sure, if 100% of the board traffic was flaming, that would be bad. But that's never been the case on R&RCE.

So to sum up, if someone is trolling, so what? They can do that. No biggie.

>I've called my fellow conservatives
>out on their trolling many times on boards like this,
>including some people I know in real life. It's
>long past time for the R&RC Left to embrace the same
>integrity.

ST, just for the record, this is the definition of a troll. The second definition is the relevant one:

troll 1. v.,n. [From the Usenet group alt.folklore.urban] To utter a posting on Usenet designed to attract predictable responses or flames; or, the post itself. Derives from the phrase "trolling for newbies" which in turn comes from mainstream "trolling", a style of fishing in which one trails bait through a likely spot hoping for a bite. The well-constructed troll is a post that induces lots of newbies and flamers to make themselves look even more clueless than they already do, while subtly conveying to the more savvy and experienced that it is in fact a deliberate troll. If you don't fall for the joke, you get to be in on it. 2. n. An individual who chronically trolls in sense 1; regularly posts specious arguments, flames or personal attacks to a newsgroup, discussion list, or in email for no other purpose than to annoy someone or disrupt a discussion. Trolls are recognizable by the fact that they have no real interest in learning about the topic at hand - they simply want to utter flame bait. Like the ugly creatures they are named after, they exhibit no redeeming characteristics, and as such, they are recognized as a lower form of life on the net, as in, "Oh, ignore him, he's just a troll."


Okay, do Queer and Dash chronically post troll messages? Sometimes they do, sometimes not. The same is true of just about everyone who posts on R&R, left and right alike. Dash & Queer also post quality messages that debate the issues. Posting troll messages from time to time does not make one a troll. Everyone does that. Scott, even you have posted messages that seemed to have the sole purpose of flaming (I have seen them), and you would agree that you're not a troll, correct?

Do Queer and Dash have no real interest in the topics at hand? The answer to that is obviously no. They take keen interest in the usual topics discussed in R&R. Even if you believe that they don't, you are in the unenviable position of having to prove it before you can use this justification to call them trolls.

Do Dash and Queer exhibit no redeeming characteristics? Of course they exhibit redemming characteristcs, unless you want to argue otherwise. Are they ignored as trolls by the general populace of the R&R? Of course not, they are active participants in discussion.

So you see, ST, your label of "troll" is quite misplaced and quite wrong. If you continue to label them as "trolls", you would be force-fitting a definition to the word "troll" that nobody on the internet uses but you, and what point is that?

If you want to say that Dash & Queer trolled you, sure, that's fine. If you want to be very accurate, say something like "those guys who taunt and criticize me". That much would be true. But giving them a label is a comment directed to their personhood, not on what they are doing, which is misplaced. Like I said before, the "troll" label not only is inaccurate by definition, it also diminishes them as being less than people, positioning you as being superior to others. This is precisely the stance you need to avoid.

RW

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