Double-talk and loaded language -- RSQUBF discussion forum

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Date Posted: 17:46:15 10/13/04 Wed
Author: Anonymous
Subject: Double-talk and loaded language
In reply to: Brian Karcher 's message, "Re: Thoughts to your response..." on 18:48:30 10/11/04 Mon

I'm sorry, but Brian's message was full of the double-talk and loaded language that we all know to expect from UBF leaders.

Check out this double-talk: "I am not trying to defend UBF." It reminds me of when my former chapter director said "I am not brainwashing anyone."

>If UBF was destroyed
>today, I would still be serving God the way I am
>tomorrow.

Reminiscent of the words of John Jun, my former chapter director, and every other Sam Lee clone out there - "If all UBF magically disappeared tomorrow, still I will do God's work (eg. propagate UBFism)."

>Yes, I've considered whether leader's
>intentions aren't what they seem.

Brian, you haven't considered good enough. Try taking a vacation from UBF for a couple months or a couple years to free yourself of the taint. Or have a good chat with Dr. Paul Martin or Mary Chrnalogar. Then things may begin to become clear.

>after
>attending nearly every Friday meeting, fellowship
>meeting, Bible study, group Bible study, worship
>service and conference.

Those are a lot of meetings. I wonder if Brian was able to skip any of those meetings without feeling an overwhelming guilt. I know I was unable to, until the very end when I was getting myself out.

>I have participated in communion and baptism. These
>are handled carefully and not done superfically as in
>many churches, so that they have real meaning.

Wow. This is unheard of. UBF never taught anything about communion or baptism. Now, all of a sudden, they have become the world experts on the subject! Not like those other "superficial" churches who participate in ceremonies with no "real meaning."

If Brian has anything real to say to back up his claims, I would like to hear it.

>Fear of UBF is not what I fear. I do fear God, though.
>I thank God for a ministry that is able to teach and
>plant the fear of God.

"The fear of God!" One of those loaded UBF catch-phrases. In UBF, God = your shepherd or your chapter director. This is what is wrong with shepherding systems! Or maybe I'm wrong and Brian would like to explain what the "fear of God" is and how UBF is so much better at teaching this than any other church.

>They had some good
>points, but not one of them taught mission as a
>reality.

Brian, now's your chance! Since you know so much more about "mission as a reality" than all these other churches, maybe you can tell us what it is? What's the secret?

>Most seemed to be social-oriented.

Reflective of general UBF propaganda - all churches but ours are "lukewarm," "just social gatherings."

>I am not
>saying all churches outside of UBF are so bad

My chapter director once said a similar white lie. The truth is 99% of the time he heavily pressured us into believing that UBF is better than every other church out there and that your salvation is inextricably tied to your UBF membership. 1% of the time, just to make it seem like he wasn't completely off his rocker, he'd say something like, "There may be some true Christians outside UBF."

>So, we are to keep "church-hopping" until we find
>someone who will teach what our itching ears want to
>hear?

Some people do church-hopping. I find this is not helpful. After leaving UBF, I tried out Lutheran, Baptist and Presbyterian churches, before settling on a United Methodist Church that is one million times better than any UBF chapter I've heard of.

>I agree totally. It is possible that God would lead
>you away from UBF. God is not leading me in that
>direction.

Brian might consider the possibility that he is not listening to God, that he can't hear God's voice because he has been so well-programmed by his UBF "friends."

>Isn't the real
>motive of this board to pull people away from UBF? As
>a student of the Bible, I would suggest finding a
>different mission, like pulling people toward God.

Hmm. I find God and UBF to be diametrically opposed. So, pulling people away from UBF, is at least getting them closer to the right direction. That ain't so bad.

>This is the last post from me for this week.

Have fun preparing your Sunday message Brian!

Regards,
Anonymous ex-UBFer

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Replies:

Re: No double-talk, loaded language or code words -- Brian Karcher, 10:57:20 10/19/04 Tue
- Theory and practice... -- Chris, 17:20:52 10/19/04 Tue
- Continued double-talk and evasion of the issues -- Anonymous, 19:15:47 10/19/04 Tue