VoyForums
[ Show ]
Support VoyForums
[ Shrink ]
VoyForums Announcement: Programming and providing support for this service has been a labor of love since 1997. We are one of the few services online who values our users' privacy, and have never sold your information. We have even fought hard to defend your privacy in legal cases; however, we've done it with almost no financial support -- paying out of pocket to continue providing the service. Due to the issues imposed on us by advertisers, we also stopped hosting most ads on the forums many years ago. We hope you appreciate our efforts.

Show your support by donating any amount. (Note: We are still technically a for-profit company, so your contribution is not tax-deductible.) PayPal Acct: Feedback:

Donate to VoyForums (PayPal):

[ Login ] [ Contact Forum Admin ] [ Main index ] [ Post a new message ] [ Search | Check update time | Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, [5], 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 ]

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Date Posted: Thu, Sep 20, 05:24:20pm CST
Author: Rex
Author Host/IP: cpe-065-188-185-013.triad.res.rr.com / 65.188.185.13
Subject: Re: Merelikins, Swerles, and Pie Balds ????
In reply to: perry 's message, "Re: Merelikins, Swerles, and Pie Balds ????" on Thu, Sep 20, 02:25:30pm CST

>>>>>>>>>> What in the world are those? Just three of
>>many
>>>>>>>>color
>>>>>>>>>>patterns that can appear in breeds with merle
>>>and
>>>>>>>>>>brindle genes. Some breeds do not allow mating
>>>>dog
>>>>>>>>>>with merle to a female with brindle, or solid
>>>>>>blacks
>>>>>>>>>>and blues to tan trims ,or fawns to any of
>>>>>>>>>>above.Reason being,each mating compounds the
>>>>>>>factors.
>>>>>>>>>>genetic modifiers can have either positive or
>>>>>>>>>>negitive, and to various degrees. I'm sure
>many
>>>>>>have
>>>>>>>>>>seen a white deer with spots, Pie bald, or
>>>>>mulatto?
>>>>>>>A
>>>>>>>>>>"Merlikin", or properly, a Merlequin, has
>genes
>>>>>>from
>>>>>>>>>>both merle and Harliquin. "Swerles" are merle
>>>and
>>>>>>>>>>brindle with modified color gene, often called
>>a
>>>>>>>>>>"Camo". Very few of these are seen in our
>>>present
>>>>>>>day
>>>>>>>>>>Leopards but I asure you they can evenyually
>>get
>>>>>>>>>>there. I've old photos of Plott Curs manys
>>years
>>>>>>>>back,
>>>>>>>>>>showing them.Seen it in Julys. Great Danes had
>>>>>them
>>>>>>>>>>real bad and then prohibited crossing
>different
>>>>>>>>>>patterns. The July breeders bred for ability
>>>only
>>>>>>>and
>>>>>>>>>>this crazy patterns persisted. Catahoulas have
>>>>>>>>>>this..Five genetic modifiers that produce
>>white,
>>>>>>>>other
>>>>>>>>>>than outside influence. Me thinks we know
>>very,
>>>>>>>very
>>>>>>>>>>little about the color "Leopard" ! There are
>>>some
>>>>>>>>>>informing articles on this subject, I've
>>studied
>>>>>>>>them,
>>>>>>>>>>only to conclude it was way over my
>>>head,,,.Color
>>>>>>is
>>>>>>>>>>only ONE of fourteen traits in a treedog. Rex
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>I've read a few of the more common books on
>>>>>>genetics,
>>>>>>>>>none of which I have commited to memory for
>>>>>>certain.
>>>>>>>>>I got one from Jed Prendergast last year and it
>>>>was
>>>>>>>>>the most easy and informative of all that I
>have
>>>>>>>>>looked at. It's title is GENETICS by Jackie
>>>>>>>Isabell.
>>>>>>>>>In short it states that the locus M allele is,
>>>>"The
>>>>>>>>>most complex of all pairs (Mm)...The m allele
>is
>>>>an
>>>>>>>>>excellent example of pleiotropy--the phenomenon
>>>of
>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>>single allele causing a number of distinct and
>>>>>>>>>seemingly unrelated phenotiypic effects. Even
>>>>when
>>>>>>>>>heterozygous, the M allele is associated qith
>>>some
>>>>>>>>>deafness ans well as occasional wall
>eyes...When
>>>>>>>>>homozygous the dogs usually have samll eyes
>with
>>>>>>blue
>>>>>>>>>or partly blue irises, and they often have
>>>>impaired
>>>>>>>>>hearing and fertility." Merle coloring is very
>>>>>hard
>>>>>>>>>on my head. I wish I had a buddy who knew more
>>>>>>about
>>>>>>>>>it. I think I'm going to have to call the
>>>>>>>university.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Rex I really enjoy your post I learn from them
>>>and
>>>>>>>>they make me think some to.You know me thinking
>>is
>>>>>>bad
>>>>>>>>lol.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Here is a lengthy article on Canine Color
>Genetics
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Ramie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>>>>href="http://bowlingsite.mcf.com/Genetics/ColorGe
>n
>>.
>>>h
>>>>t
>>>>>m
>>>>>>l
>>>>>>>">http://bowlingsite.mcf.com/Genetics/ColorGen.ht
>m
>>l
>>><
>>>>/
>>>>>a
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Good article, all in one spot. Hard to absorb in
>>>one
>>>>>>sitting...kind of like Thanksgiving:). Takes
>about
>>>a
>>>>>>week to eat everything you've cooked.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>It is I have to read it about 10 times LOL....
>>>>>
>>>>>Here is another....
>>>>>
>>>>>Ringstreaked, Speckled, and Spotted
>>>>>
>>>>> >>>>>href="http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF8/84
>6
>>.
>>>h
>>>>t
>>>>>ml">http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF8/846.
>h
>>t
>>>m
>>>>l
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Ramie
>>>> GREAT !!! now, we are thinking. In the
>>beginning;Gen.
>>>>1:24 Then God said, "Let the earth bring forth the
>>>>living creature according to its
>kind:......25....and
>>>>God saw that it WAS good." I beleive that. I also
>>>>beleive there are some things we will never
>copletley
>>>>figure out; Isaiah 55:8 "For My thoughts are not
>your
>>>>thoughts, Nor are your ways My ways" says the Lord.
>>>>"For as the heavens are higherthan the earth, So are
>>>>My ways higher than your ways, and My thoughts than
>>>>yours".
>>>> Thru the years scientist learn that what they once
>>>>thought , was wrong, and come up with new ideas,
>only
>>>>to later learn, again, wrong. It seemed correct at
>>>>that time.We just need to put all this in
>>perspective,
>>>>and keep learning!
>>>> James1:19 "So then, my beloved brethren,let every
>>man
>>>>be SWIFT to hear, SLOW to speak[type!],and SLOW to
>>>>wrath." Rex
>>>
>>>
>>>This is a question for some of you fellas studying
>the
>>>genetic color phases. Is it possible for a black
>>>female to throw a double merle??
>>
>>Yes and No…. Leopard Gene for Coat color has to be on
>>Multiple Loci and is a lot more complex that what I am
>>about to try explain. If the Black female would have
>>to carry Mm (merle) but be on the recessive
>>relationship of the multiple loci. In other words she
>>carried the gene you just can’t see it….She could then
>>produce pups with MM (double merle). If she carried
>>mm(non merle) then no she couldn’t have any pups that
>>was MM (double merle). Now please take in a count the
>>sire genes has to be at least Mm (merle) for this to
>>work out. If he only carried mm(non-merle)there would
>>be 75% mm to 25% Mm and no MM.
>>
>>
>>Ramie
>I believe the sire in the case I was thinking of had
>to be Mm Thanks Perry
Perry, in my opinion a black dog can not produce double merle, or albino.In 35 years I've never seen it happen. A double merle, likewise, cannot produce solid black. This is one way to test breed and see if the white on a dog comes from double merle. A merle and a merlikin, can both produce black offspring from a merle mating. A merlikin produces same percentages as a merle. Bred Jake to Pester[solid black/brindle] got NO white. Bred him to leopard color female and got about two solids in each litter. If the white on Jake came from double merle ,Neither would have been posible Rex

[ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[ Contact Forum Admin ]

Forum timezone: GMT-8
VF Version: 3.00b, ConfDB:
Before posting please read our privacy policy.
VoyForums(tm) is a Free Service from Voyager Info-Systems.
Copyright © 1998-2019 Voyager Info-Systems. All Rights Reserved.