are ubf leaders really "leaders" -- RSQUBF discussion forum

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Date Posted: 12:18:46 09/30/04 Thu
Author: Nick T.
Subject: are ubf leaders really "leaders"

I would like to throw this topic out there for discussion. Is a ubf leader fit to be called a "leader"?

I looked over descriptions of what normal Christian ministries would consider a ministry leader. I came across a website that divided up the leadership position into several elements, which could be construed as having several leading people in a church. There was the church leader (pastor), worship leader, board member, and pastoral staff.

There was alot of differentiation between the various leaders. If anyone is interested in discussing the important differences in each type of leader, please say so.

After researching this topic, it occurred to me that ubf has a leadership that may not have any gifts or qualities that are necessary for effective leaders. There are many ubf chapters where the director is obviously deficient in most categories and the chapter never grows, consider such groups as Milwaukee, Cinci, DePaul, Northwestern, Northeastern, etc.

The fault lies in the ubf leader for being unqualified or ungifted, and in the ubf system for propping up such unqualified people. It also helps explain why a ubf environment seems so sterile, and little more than a carbon copy of the other ubf groups.

I also wanted to point out Brian's 15 years as a ubf leader. Here is what he wrote:

>Here is my opinion of what happens when a person
>leaves ubf. I have met with dozens who have left,
>Karcher has not met with any.

So you know that for a fact?

>As a final comment, Brain, please tell us exactly how
>many recruits you have made in the last 15 yers?

UBF is not about finding "recruits", but about making disciples and preaching the gospel. There are 5 students who found salvation in Jesus Christ through my Bible studies. Only one of these students now attend UBF services. None of the others have any malice toward me or UBF. They found the word of God and moved on. Preaching the gospel is not a business. Preaching the gospel is about obeying the word of God and lifting up Jesus. The mother of two of these students often still thank me, even recently, for Bible studies with their sons, as their son's sinful lives have changed. The parents of two others were quite grateful for my help to their sons during a difficult time in their lives.

This man (Brian "The Brain" Karcher) spent 15 years to witness ubfstyle to 5 people, and one remains in ubf. A normal pastor can witness to 5 people in one day. What makes Brian a leader, other than he stacks up well compared to the other unqualifieds at ubf?

Not picking on you only Brian, but I am picking on you. Hope that some legitimate criticism may help being you to your senses. ubf is not the right way for the above and a million other reasons.

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Replies:

Re: are ubf leaders really "leaders" -- Joe, 15:26:07 09/30/04 Thu
- guaranteed low quality of ubf leaders -- Nick T., 17:05:17 10/01/04 Fri
  - The "Layman" excuse -- Mike K., 12:24:06 10/02/04 Sat
    - Re: The "Layman" excuse -- E, 14:43:17 10/02/04 Sat