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Date Posted: 08:36:53 10/11/04 Mon
Author: Brian Karcher
Subject: Re: Obedience
In reply to: Chris 's message, "Re: Obedience" on 10:26:26 10/10/04 Sun

>Would you agree that it is not only "not explicitely
>Biblical," but even "explicitely unbiblical" (Acts
>4:19,5:29)? Why always waver around?

Chris, I pray that someday you may study the Bible with a learning mind, like that of a child, rather than with such a complicated mind.

Both of the verses you quote are taken out of context. The question asked above was concerning believers submitting to leaders *within* the ministry. The passages you mention above are about the disciples defending the gospel to those *outside* their ministry, at at time when the disciples were being put on trial.

Here is what I mean. Take a look at the context of the verse you quoted, Acts 4:19. The verses leading up to this say:

Acts 4:5-19 "5 The next day the rulers, elders and teachers of the law met in Jerusalem. 6 Annas the high priest was there, and so were Caiaphas, John, Alexander and the other men of the high priest's family. 7 They had Peter and John brought before them and began to question them: "By what power or what name did you do this?"

>>> Notice that the disciples are being interrogated here but religious leaders who were not part of their ministry. These religious leaders wanted them to stop preaching the gospel. This has nothing to do with mutual submission in the body of Christ.

8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them: "Rulers and elders of the people! 9 If we are being called to account today for an act of kindness shown to a cripple and are asked how he was healed, 10 then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. 11 He is "'the stone you builders rejected, which has become the capstone.' 12 Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved." 13 When they saw the courage of Peter and John and realized that they were unschooled, ordinary men, they were astonished and they took note that these men had been with Jesus.

>>> Notice here that the disciples were called unschooled, ordinary men. Where do you think Dr.Samuel Lee got his idea that the disciples were unschooled, ordinary men?

14 But since they could see the man who had been healed standing there with them, there was nothing they could say. 15 So they ordered them to withdraw from the Sanhedrin and then conferred together. 16 "What are we going to do with these men?" they asked. "Everybody living in Jerusalem knows they have done an outstanding miracle, and we cannot deny it. 17 But to stop this thing from spreading any further among the people, we must warn these men to speak no longer to anyone in this name."

>>> Again, the issue in question is not mutual submission to leaders within the church, but whether disciples of Jesus should submit to those who were trying to stop them from preaching the gospel.

18 Then they called them in again and commanded them not to speak or teach at all in the name of Jesus. 19 But Peter and John replied, "Judge for yourselves whether it is right in God's sight to obey you rather than God." (NIV)

In conclusion, the disciples clearly taught obedience and submission to fellow Christians, as I said earlier. The passage above is concerning a different issue. It is the same with the other verse you quote, Acts 5:29 (see Acts 5:1-29). These passages teach clearly that in the case of preaching the gospel, disciples must obey God more than men. When the authority of man, religious or otherwise, conflicts with preaching the gospel, we are directed to obey God not men.

Immanuel,
Brian

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