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Date Posted: 22:20:52 08/16/04 Mon
Author: Mitch
Subject: Re: To Mitch and J
In reply to: Nick T. 's message, "To Mitch and J" on 09:56:44 08/13/04 Fri

Hello Nick,

I have not been to UBF in the last two worship services. I gave them bach their stuff. Then I wrote a note to the director. Over the weekend they came over to my house, but I was out of town. I know that because today they surprisingly showed up where I work. They stayed for about 45 minutes. Although it crossed my mind that they would come to where I work, I did not think they would actually do this. The "meeting" was friendly, they wanted to know if they had done something that offended me. I told them not at all, but that I wanted to go to a different church where there were more than just university students (this is true, I have been thinking this since before i found this site). They seem to be ok with that but they wanted to know if it was God directing me or just my own feelings. Then they talked about different churches, he admitted that one ubf member married a spouse that was not a ubf member and Samual Lee was furious. He talked some about tithes and finally said that he thought somehow I was upset at them and just wanted to leave. He recommened that I stay in the fellowship until I receive a specific direction.

Either these ubf people are sincerely mislead, or they are con men that are masters of decieveing people. I am confused because they seem so sincere, but after reading so many testimonies on this site I am VERY sure I need to stay away from them. The chapter here is samll, and that is probably why I don't see major problems like other chapters do.

Please tell me what you think about their visit to me while I was at work. I do not plan under any circumstances to ever go back there. I have told them very politely that I desire to go to another church. If they visit me again I will have to tell them that I am sure it is God's will for me to be in another church. Can you think of anything else I should do? I know God will deliver me in this matter, and I appreciate the help of all the people on this site.

One other thing, I did not bring up any information I have found on this site or others regarding ubf. I feel that if I confront them with it they will say it is false and encourage me to come back. What do you think? If they continue to invite me back, should I just tell them I don't think their fellowship is safe because their lisence was revoked by the NAE? They obviously have HUGE problems, why should I stay, why should anyone stay?

>Dear Mitch,
>
>I had a chance to talk to some other exubfers about
>your scenario. One person said that she believed that
>they had a plan to send you to Korea as soon as
>possible in order to get you into position to have YOU
>get married on Ocotber 9th in Chicago. I had not
>thought of that, but after pondering, it seems like
>they were angling to at least get you ready in case
>they want to pull the trigger on your marriage.
>
>One thing you may not know, but October 9 is the
>birthday of the late Samuel Lee (alias EE Chang Woo).
>ubf likes to have marriages on his birthday to
>dedicate the couples to EE.
>
>Mitch, the violence issue is not something that you
>will see in public on the platform during the Sunday
>service. It has been taken underground, behind the
>scenes. In ubfKorea there was corporal punishment on
>a daily basis. One man who left ubf during the 1976
>schism and is now a pastor of ESF says that the basic
>training in Korean ubf was for the guys to come to the
>center after class, study a Bible passage, and then
>endure some kind of corporal punishment such as beat
>each others buttocks, run untill exhaustion, form a
>gauntlet and beat each other harshly, have boxing
>mataches untill one is beaten up, etc. There are many
>stories of running in public dressed only in
>underwear, sitting in a tub full of ice water for many
>hours, and there was even an offical training called
>starvation training, where the 'interns', those who
>had been in ubf for more than a few years and who were
>willing to do whatever told, well they were deprived
>of all food except a bowl of ramen per day. Then they
>would do ubf for 20 hours a day, and get weighed at
>the end of the day. After a few weeks of this they
>looked like skeletons, but they claimed that they were
>mortifying their flesh and becoming full of the power
>of the Holy Spirit. Many would say it is no more
>spiritual than Moslems who beat themselves with stones
>untill they bleed.
>
>When ubf first came to the USA, they tried this
>violence on American recruits, after the love bombing
>phase. Because of violence and abuse most American
>recruits left. That is why there are so few recruits
>at ubf who have been there prior to 1984. When number
>one recruit Tim B. walked out on the ubf, that was the
>end of the public physical abuse.
>
>But there is an after effect, so many of the
>ubfKoreans, esp. the ancient ones, take great pride in
>their involvement in the days of rampant physical
>abuse. They consider Americans as soft and weak, and
>even cowardly, because we do not condone their abusive
>ways.
>
>A result of the loss of physical abuse, there has been
>a great refinement in the ubfforms of mental and
>emotional and financial abuse. But the ubf comes at
>us little by little, with some of their actions
>bordering on Biblical. However, when we step back and
>compare the ubf to reputable Christian groups, we can
>see very clearly that ubf is outside the bounds of the
>Scriptures. How about arranged marriage? Did Jesus
>or Paul or Peter ever arrange a marriage? Well why is
>EE (dead) and Barry and PChang arranging marriages?
>The form of church government at ubf is in direct
>conflict with the Bible. Also, ubfleaders have no
>basic qualifications to be considered as pastors.
>Reputable pastors are highly educated in the Bible and
>Bible history and church hisotry, trained, and held to
>high standards of conduct and speech. ubf pastors
>must do nothing other than demonstrate unconditional
>loyalty and obedience to their ubf leadership. Check
>out the Billy Graham Center in Wheaton IL, which is a
>museum dedicated to the history of evangelism in
>Ameirca. What you learn there will be totally
>opposite what ubf says.
>
>I am going to write a book on ubf, and would like to
>ask others to put their stories in it. Maybe we can
>have a book with 20 or 25 chapters, each person write
>a chapter about his or her won experience. Mitch, you
>are lucky you only spent a couple years there at ubf,
>I have been suffering from ubfdisease since the fall
>of 1983, due to being ubfmarried in 1989 and now going
>thru ubfdivorce for almost three full years (She filed
>for the divorce, at the direction of ubf leaders). My
>former ubfmissionary has stopped calling me, after I
>sent him a message letting him know that he failed me
>as my shepherd.
>
>J, Chris is right, you are in the love bombing phase.
>And it seems you may be a highly desired type of
>ubfrecruit, so you may be treated very special at ubf.
> They are desparate for the faces of white American
>ladies, not sure if you fall into that category. But
>you are valuable as a smart lady grad student. They
>may have a plan to do some major league butt kissing
>to you for many years, sorry for the lack of a better
>term. If so they will pump you up with so much pride
>yo uwill not know what planet you are on. Stick to
>your guns, be yourself, and get your friends and
>family involved in your ubf decision process.
>
>God bless you both. Find a reputable group and learn
>the Bible in the correct way. Jesus Christ died one
>time for all the sins of the world. We need only
>accept his all sufficient grace one time for all of
>our sins, even the sins we didn't commit yet. That is
>all it takes to be a Christian, because we are saved
>by the grace of God, not by anything we have done.
>God bless you all. Sorry for being long winded.

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