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Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: Friday, December 06, 2024, 01:55: am In reply to: AV 's message, "Re: Babysitter and toileting help" on Thursday, December 05, 2024, 04:15: pm I know and I feel responsible for putting her in this situation. If she is backed up at all the nurse is going to get aggressive with enemas because of her history of needing Fleet enemas often to keep her going. I've only met her mom once when we first found her for a babysitter for our boys. And have only talked to her on the phone a hand full of times. She strikes me not as a strict mom but as maybe a no nonsense person. That's why I was kind of shocked at how talkative and open her girl is about her toileting. I'm thinking of her right now hoping she is in bed a sleeping comfortably now. I hope she is not mad at me. [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Friday, December 06, 2024, 04:25: am AV, Interesting turn of events for sure. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Saturday, December 07, 2024, 06:30: pm Shelly, I am crazy right now writting to myself in the above post. That post was for you. lol. Have you heard from your sitter? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 03:48: pm AV, I texted her yesterday just saying are you okay? Hoping she would tell me how the enema went. Hoping she and her mom weren't mad at me. About two hours later all she texted was I'm OK. So last night I couldn't stand the guilt any more and texted mom that I was sorry if I caused any trouble for babysitter because I think so much of her and felt bad that I got her in trouble. I got almost an immediate phone call from mom. Wow, we talked for over an hour! So here is the gist of what mom and I talked about. Daughter is defiant and stubborn and talks back to mom about her toileting. She is supposed to be on daily metamucil and miralax as of four years ago. After a few weeks and few accidents at school she absolutely refused to take any oral treatment. Her constipation really only started when she was deep into puberty. When she was thirteen she started wetting the bed at night because she was going three and four days without pooping. Maybe wetting herself two or three times a month. She wet the bed she got a Fleet enema. It was and is still always a big fight. Mom has to threaten to take privileges away if she doesn't do a Fleet enema. Mom has to guess when she maybe has gone three or four days without pooping from her overall mood and appetite and will force a Fleet enema. She said she was sassy and smart mouth to her when she told her that I said warm water enemas are more comfortable than Fleet enemas. She didn't tell her I offered to teach her warm water enemas she just thought she was using it as a tool to get out of any more Fleet enemas. So she called home health care and asked them if they would come clean her out rectally. They made her take daughter to Urgent Care for an x-ray and have a provider read it and say if she needed to be cleaned out. Thursday after school, done and yes, impacted. Two young nurses came, took her vitals. And had her in mom's master bedroom with a toilet just three steps away and had her in there for over three hours. They said they gave her a small enema to empty her rectum because a rectal exam showed she was full. Then she got a castile soapy enema and two high rinses. They were upset at how full of poop she was so she in now going to a gastro for further investigation. She said this was a long time coming because it has been such a fight to keep her from ending up in the hospital with a blocked colon. She actually thanked me for getting the ball rolling. I told her she had indicated she was interested in me teaching warm water enemas and that was the only reason I put her up to it. She told me if I want to clean her out when she comes to sit for us she would pay me because insurance won't pay for enema clean outs and she would just as soon give that money to me. I told her I wouldn't charge for it at all. If she thinks daughter is plugged make her come over here and I will clean her out. We together decided that until she has had her work up from a gastro and given instructions on treatment that she should be cleaned out every two weeks for now. So maybe next Sunday I'll get to clean her out. She needs to be a big girl and take serious her colon health. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 04:23: pm Shelly, Oh my goodness. The sitter has had colon issues for a long time and her mom has been trying to help her. You may have just saved your sitter’s life. You have always wanted to give her an enema and so here you are. You must be excited. But the truth is, you are helping her and her mom. So glad you made the decision to call mom and talk. Plus you will do a good job of teaching and helping her by cleaning her out. So proud! Please keep us posted. All of this coming about all because you decided to start junior on enemas and ask your sitter to help! [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 05:47: pm AV Yeah, daughter has been dodging a bullet getting impacted so bad that she wets the bed. Mom said she hasn't wet the bed for about 5 months now and hoping that has stopped for good. Daughter hasn't spoken a word to mom since her enemas. She is giving the silent treatment and has stayed mostly in her bedroom all weekend. Mom said she looked like a deer in the headlights and had tears after the young nurses did her vitals and took her by the hand into her bedroom and shut the door behind them. That has got to be quite a shock to a 15 year old to have two really young females that you don't know take you into the bedroom for three hours and give you a rectal exam and then several enemas and stay there with you while you are on the toilet getting those enemas back out. And of course she wasn't allowed to flush so they could see how she was doing. They left mom with a waste basket full of toilet paper wipes to throw away because they made her put her wipes in the waste basket not the toilet. If mom sends her to me to clean her out she is getting the same soapy then rinse enemas to make sure we empty her. She is not going to like that. She will be with me for enemas for about three hours. So anyway, I felt so relieved and relaxed talking to a clear headed mom that I told her about my first ever enema and how much it scared me too. She said she never had a suppository or enema growing up. When she had her first gyno the Dr. did what she later learned is called a recto-vaginal and told her to bear down like she is trying to have a bowel movement and she remembers it like it was yesterday because it was so degrading. It scared her so bad and she was so mad the he did it. So she understands her daughter doesn't like anyone putting things in her rectum. I told her I get it too. But, she can not be allowed to get impacted like this. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Joyce [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 11:23: pm Shelly, AV has pointed out to you that your sitter and you have developed a trust. If sitter's mom sends her to you for a clean-out, please don't just do what the nurses did last Friday by forcing her against her will to take a small rectal enema followed by large volume soapy and two rinse enemas. Although that will be effective, it will almost certainly destroy the trust between you and your sitter. I strongly suggest that you tell sitter that you understand how unpleasant and uncomfortable last Friday was and that you want to start with the procedure both of you use with Junior. Although at her age she should be able to take two quarts of almost hot water, I suggest you start with the nozzle fully inserted and only one quart. Assure her that you will be gentle and and will stop if she is in pain. Remove the nozzle and encourage her to try to hold the enema for 10 minutes. Then re-fill the bag with another quart of water, re-insert the nozzle and try to get her to take as much as she can, even if it is uncomfortable. Again reassure her that you will stop and let her use the toilet if she is in pain. By the two of you working together you can build on your trust and prepare for a more thorough cleansing next time. - Joyce [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Joyce [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Monday, December 09, 2024, 08:31: pm Shelly, Given the duration and severity of your sitter's bowel problems, I don't believe the single two part enema I described will be fully effective. I understand that you and sitter's mom agreed to a clean-out like the nurses did every two weeks, but I suggested a single enema as means for you and sitter to continue to build trust in each other. However, after two or three weeks I believe that she may have enough stool build-up in the upper part of her colon to need a more thorough cleansing like the nurses did to get it all out. So after the first time or two I think you will need to have a talk with sitter about a more thorough clean-out. Explain to her that next time you will have use two or three large enemas with soap in the first one to make sure you get everything out. You will be gentle, but this must be done. If she doesn't agree to cooperate, you will have to have her mother call the nurses back to do it. Until your gastro doctor prescribes something different I believe this is necessary to avoid further problems. - Joyce [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 05:24: am Joyce, I've been up most of the night because I can't sleep worrying about her. Daughter texted me finally yesterday and just said that the nurses scared her so much because the enemas were so awful and took for ever and they told her she might have megacolon and it concerned them. So naturally that scared her. So I called mom last night and we agree with you 100 percent. I've got to secure her trust with just one high enema first. But mom is adamant she wants an aggressive cleanse like the nurses gave her again soon to see how backed up she gets. So she is going to be ordered to come to me Wed. after school and I'll ease her into a discussion about how much trouble she is in and then we will do a large enema for her. Then we will see how things go and maybe just do a single enema again next Wednesday. And then in three weeks we will give her castile enema and rinses and I'll make her show me what we are getting out of her. Mom can't get her in to see a gastro. Dr. until late Jan. so it is on us until then to keep her from getting so impacted. Your insight is so important to me and I appreciate your wisdom. We will get her on a simple one enema routine for maintenance and do the thorough cleanses as we feel needed. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Joyce [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 04:07: pm Shelly, Glad to hear that sitter's mom agrees with us and supports you. Please let me know how sitter's visit goes Wednesday when she comes over after school. Be kind and gentle. Megacolon can be a serious condition. My understanding is that it develops slowly and takes diligence and a long time to reverse. Let me know what you get out of her tomorrow. - Joyce [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 04:43: pm Joyce, So after I get her enema in her I'm going to let her be alone and close the bathroom door behind me. I'm not going to make her show me what I get out of her. I want to save her that embarrassment for now. I am going to make her tell me how many times she has pooped, if at all, since her clean out. I'm really hoping she has pooped at least once by now. That would be the best case scenario. We are going to operate on the hope that she does not have a super stretched out colon that can not be reversed. Mom saw her x-ray and the PA. pointed out stool present throughout her whole colon. She didn't do a rectal but the nurses did and they told mom when they emptied her rectum to prep her for her first castile enema that she had a huge bowel movement. I promise I will check in with you all as soon as I am done getting her enema in her and how she responded to me. I will be very gentle and ease her in to her first enema with me by just sitting and talking through things with her before we go in and do the enema. I will treat her with all the love and caring as if she were my own. But if she ever gives me any static or gets sassy with me like she treats her mom we will have issues and I can be firm if pushed. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Joyce [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 06:09: pm Shelly, Thanks for responding before sitter arrived. If you are uncomfortable with posting details of your session, you can email me at JoyceEdwards64@proton.me. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 06:55: pm Joyce, I feel liberated, freed from my inhibitions and inability to talk to anyone about my growing up in a house where enemas were almost a daily occurrence with 7 children. For the longest time I felt dirty and disgusting because I missed that first ever enema I got from stepmom. I know there is an audience on here that may have that same shame feeling of being dirty now as an adult because they too would like one of mom's enemas again. I want to shout as loudly as I can that is okay to give your children enemas. Thousands and thousands of parents spend millions of dollars at specialty hospitals for their children's poop issues only to be told to go home and give them enemas. I check my email inbox about once every three months. I don't do emails. Anyone who wants to do business with me knows to use the phone or snail mail. I don't have to look you in the eye when I share my life growing up with enemas. It is a release for me now that I kept it inside for so long. I'm so excited about giving her an enema tomorrow that as soon as I got my youngest down for a nap I had to go and do a huge enema because I just want to be that child again. I role play in my head as the child and mom at the same time filling the bag with two and a half quarts and telling the child, myself, that I have to take the whole bag. I try to get the experience back, not the same but close. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Bonnie's Kid [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 06:11: pm I follow many of the discussions relative to the use of enemas for a variety of conditions. It appears that you (Shelley) are getting some great advice from others (Joyce & AV) who are concerned about you, your kids, and the Babysitter. Most of what I would offer would be redundant and repetitive. I have posted before, that I always perceived those frequent enemas I got as a kid, were punitive in nature. I also had a great deal of resentment toward my pediatrician and his nurse Marge. I had been threatened with hospitalization to deal with my elimination and constipation issues. I may well have been a "holder" as others have posted about. One thing that I learned as I got older, was that mom, grandma, and the doctor were merely trying to assist me through a trying time of my life. In hindsight, I believe they were pretty abrupt and gruff with me although they likely had very good intentions. I'm sure that my resistance and tantrums precipitated the spankings etc. I believe I was a pretty smart kid and would likely have appreciated them explaining the procedures and desired outcomes with greater patience. I read many medical texts and had an understanding of the procedures but the adults didn't want any discussion regarding my concerns. I did begin self administration at age 6. I believe it was more of a survival instinct although I did begin to discover some positive sensations and contention with the adults was often mitigated. I didn't need to lie any more about producing those daily BM's which were expected and often monitored. While my enema use was pretty secretive, I suspect that the adults had picked up on my efforts and they were less inclined to drag me into the bathroom and make me lie down in the cold tub. Once grandma died, and the pediatrician retired, mom's efforts to give me enemas was diminished. I had reached puberty and the enemas I took had some very positive effects on my overall well being. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Shelly [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 07:26: pm Bonnie's Kid, As you know I was a holder. Most holders are boys. And, get this, a huge percentage of holders are above average intelligence. What should this tell us? Because we aren't modeling pooping and peeing in front of our children to normalize it to them. Instead of just automatically voiding when feeling the urge like all animals do, they analyze it, think it through, decide there are things about it that they don't like, feel uncomfortable about. It may be from something like they had a hard painful poop. But they don't feel like they can tell mommy about it because she doesn't like to share or talk about her pooping. Shame on us. Normalize pooping parents! Model pooping parents! And if they need help the enema is right there, quick, effective, and instantly relieving. I'm going to tell babysitter tomorrow that I took an enema today. That I was up most of the night worrying about her and so upset that I needed something to calm me down. My stepmom's enemas always wore me out, maybe me exhausted, sleepy. When I was done getting my enemas back out I felt a sense of calm and relaxation. After we get past the part of her having to present naked to me so I can get the enema in her she can be alone on the toilet to release and start to feel that sense of exhaustion and tiredness and just feeling generally wore out and wanting to go to bed. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Bonnie's Kid [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Tuesday, December 10, 2024, 10:24: pm I appreciate your openness even though there's a degree of anonimity on these forums. I believe it was AV who first posted about the therapeutic value of open discussion. Our personal history and experiences have influenced our perceptions, either positive or negative. At this point in life, my memories are of the positive side of this simple procedure and pleasure. I sincerely hope you and the youngsters enjoy the relief physically and emotionally that a loving enema can bring! [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Wednesday, December 11, 2024, 06:10: am Shelly and all, Here are my thoughts and recap. Shelly, as you know, I spent months on the enema and suppository forum with Krissi chatting just like we are doing here. You remember, her and her sister came from an enema family. Her and her sister had two different styles of giving enemas. Her sister used a retention nozzle on her teenage soon with warm water. Krissi used goat milk soap and gave two rinses. She explained once the goat milk soap did not produce bubbles or cramps but simply and gently coated the intestines to give a nice bowel movement. I shared all of that as an idea. Let’s remember, you decided to use krissi’s lock and loaded over the knee procedure for enemas on junior. You also had a sitter that you one day asked to help with junior’s enema. You didn’t know anything about her past but you in your mind wanted to give her an enema. Turns out she was an enema receiver but also a fighter of enemas. The nurses scared her. But you had a trust and bond with her and now with her mom. As already suggested, be gentle. Show her an enema can be pleasant and relaxing and enjoyable. You purchased a long nozzle that goes past the rectum into the colon. I honestly believe you should give sitter the same enema you give junior, a warm water enema using that long nozzle and allow that nozzle to do its job. That nozzle is going to fill her up and that nozzle is going to clean her out simply because it’s going deep into her colon. If you decide to use soap in the future, I would recommend that goat milk soap, something gentle, something that is not going to produce cramps and gas and all of that discomfort. You sitter needs a gentle enema experience. You as well, need to enjoy giving the enema to the sitter without any tension. I believe this is going to turn out really well, and all of your dreams of wanting to start your own kids on enemas and giving your own sitter enemas is going to be fulfilled. You and your sitter have a trust. Use that. Please as always, keep us posted, as you mentioned, there may be other parents reading these forums as a silent reader looking for knowledge and insight. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 06:05: pm Shelly, I know you will take good care of her plus she will be more comfortable with you giving the enemas then anyone else. I feel you two have built a trust. We can both safety say she doesn’t want those two nurses coming back. Glad her mom as well trust you enough. Remember, this all sounds like Krissi’s oldest daughter and how much she hated enemas? [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: Kitten Paw [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Sunday, December 08, 2024, 06:27: pm Who is Krissi that you talk about? I don't see any posts from a Krissi. So I am the same age as your baby sitter and I can tell you that getting the enemas from the two young females wasn't as bad for her as them being there with her while she is on the toilet and making her show them what she is getting out. My mom's enemas make me stay on the toilet for about an hour and she will come in on me and make me stand and show her how I am doing. That is the worst part. You have to look at them looking at you and they can hear your enema coming out and into the water with a splash. Hate it hate it hate it. No Shelly I haven't given myself an enema. I have come close a couple of times. I wanted to. But the enema bag is in her cupboard in her bathroom clear on the other side of the house from my bathroom. If I tried to sneak an enema sometime I just know she would come home before I could get off the toilet and get the bag back in her bathroom or I just know she would find out that it was still wet. I would just die if she found out I wanted to give myself an enema. Why do I want something that is so awful and I hate so much? Don't get it. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> [> Subject: Re: Babysitter and toileting help Author: AV [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: Monday, December 09, 2024, 07:14: am Kitten Paw, There once was a page called suppository and enema forum. Krissi was a regular author and so was I. Shelly was like a silent reader. Krissi and I posted regularly. Krissi has 3 girls and the oldest hated enemas. When Shelly decided to start her oldest (6yo) on enemas, she followed Krissi’s way of given enemas. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]