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Subject: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Wize [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ] Date Posted: 10:11:41 05/11/02 Sat Sup everybody, I wanted to briefly talk about the true Christian view on sons and daughters of God/Christ. Now this is the Born Again Believer standpoint that can be accepted or rejected. Many people want to quote portions of scripture but then say that everyone on this planet are sons and daughters of God. This is a decieving and false statement according to true Christian doctrine. Yes, we are all formed by God, however Romans 8: 14-17 clearly defines what it is to be a Son or Daughter of God : "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out,"Abba, Father." The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs-heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together." According to this passage in the Bible, we can conclude that we are "adopted" into the family of God through accepting Jesus and His Spirit. Furthermore, as we live a life controlled by that Spirit, we are marked as Sons and Daughters. I write this message because I feel non-christians at times feel the need to change and misinterpret what the bible says (thats another topic in itself). So its your choice to accept or reject this standpoint, however I want to reitirate that the Father is only accepting His "adopted" sons and daughters. Have u been adopted? One luv in Christ, Bejoy AkA Wize of the Frontlynaz [ Next Thread | Previous Thread | Next Message | Previous Message ]

Replies:

[> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Afrikan Lion [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 10:56:50 05/13/02 Mon I must say, you do have a point, however it is a little warped when you get to the analysis. I ask all of you to re-read the scripture quoted. Nowhere in there does it say we must be Christian or take Christ as our saviour, in order to be the children of God. It simply states that those of us who suffer with Christ are the "chosen ones." Saying that to say, it is not the Christian who is the chosen, although a Christian may be chosen. It is not the Muslim, the Jew, or any other "religion" that holds the chosen people...but those who suffer with Emanuel. The oppressed. Those who go against the grain of mainstream society and fight for what's right and just, regardless of what kind of opposition they face. It is those who suffer, and those who suffer, even though they may not have to, just becaue they believe in the plight of those less fortunate, and believe in the fight to liberate them. It is these people who are the Children of God...they are the ones who march with Emanuel. Not someone in a church screamin "Yes Jesus...my Lord and Savior!" We must think outside of ourselves and whatever religion we subscribe to, in order to see the fullness of life. How the hell can we say we are truly worshiping God if we put limitations on Him. Confining His greatness to some ism or schism, laying claim to something that is not manifested within ourselves (religion) and ignoring the innate spiritual connection that we have with the Almighty. Don't limit yourself....don't limit Godself! think beyond the box. Jah guide and protect..... [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Wize [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 20:59:48 05/13/02 Mon Afrikan Lion, I can tell your a person who truly is seeking for truth and is eloquent in formulating your ideas. However, when quoting the bible you must recognize that the bible states in 2 Tim 3:16 : " All SCRIPTURE is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work." Therefore, we must look at all the scripture before "warping" one passage. Because sound knowledge of scripture brings "correction" to ill-fated misconceptions. 1) John 14:6 - "Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. NO ONE comes to the Father except through Me." Many have read that before...but have they meditated on it? 2) 2 Tim 3:12 - "Yes, and all who desire to live godly in Christ Jesus will suffer persecution" This scripture points to the fact that the suffering mentioned in my previous message relates to suffering experienced by those "In Christ".....or His Sons and Daughters 3) 1 John 2:22 - 23 - "Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ (or Savior/Messiah)? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does no have the Father either, he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also." -- Not having a Father means your not a Son or Daughter. Also, remember that the God that Christians believe in is not the same as Allah or any other. Jesus and God the Father are one in the same... As I said before, people are free to reject this viewpoint but please do not use the Christian Bible to argue Christian standpoints if you do not have full faith in the Scripture. 1 luv in Christ, Wize [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Afrikan Lion [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 07:04:51 05/14/02 Tue Once again I say....Get out of the BOX! If you see the scripture as simply scripture...that's all you'll get from it; words, you'll get no meaning. If you apply the Bible being only for Christians, then you are LIMITING the POWER of YOUR God. How can you believe that the God that you say is Different from Allah and any other is all powerful, if His truth is confined only to Christians? About the Bible, if it is as Christians claim, the book for Christians, why should I not use it to argue Christian standpoints? It most certainly would not make sense to argue for or against Christianity using the Book of Coming forth by Day from Night or the Koran, etc. Second, the idea of people who are non-Christian should not use the Bible, is rediculous because of the simple fact the the first five books of the Bible, are collectively known as the Torah, the first section of the Hebrew Bible, which is not the same as Christianity....so those who argue this are being hypocritical. Again, get out of the BOX! As I said before the true follower of Jesus Christ is the one who fights his fight. It was Jesus who said "I come not in peace, but with a sword to smite the wicked." Jesus was not persecuted for his religion....DO NOT BELIEVE THE HYPE....he was persecuted because of his beliefs in the rights of his people, and the life that he lived, in belief that his way could and would uplift the masses. When we fully see spirit, and not religion we will be lead to that bright light of Truth, so that the boxes of the shitstem to not keep us posessed. Guidance and protection Lion and Empress...Jah love. [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Wize [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 09:08:24 05/14/02 Tue AfriKan Lion, First, the bible is not just for Christians to read and investigate...noone ever said that. I said to not use the bible and twist its context especially when ur not a believer. Why are you still trying to debate Christian doctrine? The bible is simple and plain with topics such as salvation and there being only one God and Lord...Jesus Christ. This is what a Christian believes...why cant you accept that? Is it wrong for me to state my point of view as a believer and back up what I believe with scripture? Anybody is free to believe also...but let me reitirate YOU DONT HAVE TO. I can also sense your on edge writing these messages dog, be secure in ur beliefs and just accept that there is another secure in his. Cus in due time..God will make everything clear. The God I'm talking about is the same yesterday, today, and forevermore and will remain the same from the Old Testament to the New Testament and beyond. My God will never change, neither will His word, nor my faith in Him. You cannot seperate Jesus Christ, the Bible, and God. If you trust in one, you trust the other. John 1:1 " In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God....(V14) And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth". I havent just been reading words, I've applied it to my life...and if you did the same you would probably be in church with me Praising Jesus for His love and grace. So I respect your views, but your views on God and Christ are not supported in the Bible. Make a mention of that before you express yourself... Saved in the Box, Wize [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Afrikan Lion [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 10:32:48 05/14/02 Tue Well, you said it right there....Saved in the Box....well, if that's where you wanna be, then go ahead, I can only try to show light. But be careful, cause while you're saved in the box, the owner of all these boxes, may come by and cart those in boxes off to the dump, against your own will. No one is saying there's anything wrong with a spiritual being using Christianity as their "shoe" to walk through life. The problem lies when people believe that only Nike's will support their ankles from breaking, condeming those who use Reeboks or Adiddas. We get stuck defending a name brand rather than the purpose behind wearing sneakers, period. Apply that to religion. And remember this too, before I'm finished beating this dead horse..."If you are not part of the problem, you are part of the solution." You are not part of the solution if you stay "Saved in the box" because not everyone will want to be in your box, and not everyone will fit in your box. So, you are part of the problem. Knowing corruption and resting on religion is the selfishness that allows us to be saved, although our family is in bondage. Marchin to Zion... Jabriel [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> Subject: Re: Are all of us sons and daughters of God? Author: Proph [ Edit | View ] Date Posted: 21:43:43 05/14/02 Tue Afrikan Lion, I think you are not seeing the truth here. You cannot separate Christ from God and the Bible. The Old Testament is a building stage leading to the coming of Christ. Throughout the Old Testament Prophets foretold the coming of the Messiah. Jews dont believe that Christ is the Messiah and they reject the New Testament, but that doesn't mean that the coming of Christ is still not told in the Old Testament. The bible is for everyone, anyone can read the Bible, anyone can accept Christ's offer of salvation set forth in the Bible, but you cannot deny that the Bible says that God and Christ are one in the same, and that through Christ ONLY can God (the father) be reached. It's not a box, its the truth. Christian is more than a name, it means "Ones Belonging to Christ". The name is not seperate from the religion, no mere man just thought up the name. Christ's ideals and teachings are all part of the plan by God set forth in the Bible. The first Christians were named in the book of Acts by Paul, under the direction of God. The name Christian was to signify those who were followers of the teachings of Christ the son of God. Christ said over and over again how he was the son of God and how many would just not believe. I feel sorry that YOU are in the box and won't allow yourself to see the truth. If you don't accept it, thats one thing, but please don't try to twist the teachings of God, they are set in stone and scripture which cannot be changed. As far as your sneaker analogy its flawed. With a name brand there are other products that can get you the same result but with either less money or less hassle. But with Christianity, there is no other way. Those who do not accept Christ will not inherit the kingdom of God.You can make any religion you want, follow any belief system you want, but only those who accept Christ as thier personal savior and build a relationship with him based on the knowledge that he was sent by God to die on the cross for our sins so that we may become followers of Christ, or Christians, will see the reward of heaven. Like Wize said you dont have to accept it at all. I pray that you do,because I would like to see all my brothers and sisters in the family of Christ. I also pray that you open your heart to the truth. 1 in Christ, Proph [ Post a Reply to This Message ]