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Date Posted: 13:43:56 02/04/00 Fri
Author: ss
Subject: My coments are dispersed throughout
In reply to: §Matt§ 's message, "Re: Truth" on 08:41:46 02/04/00 Fri

> Truth has no levels; it exists equally throught
> existance. Perception can only pervert the truth
> through the mind. If you are lookingthrough your
> perception, which is the mind, then you cannot see
> truth; only your own projection of it. Mind must make
> a continuous projection of truth else it will become
> shaken, afraid, confused. If truth is not found, a
> projected truth will do. If one want to percieve
> truth, then they will remain at the periphery watching
> truth from a distance. Those who drop the perspective
> and realize that truth cannot be seen or touched in
> parts attain pure, unscathed awareness. That very
> awareness IS truth.
============================================================
Ah, but all you are doing is offering your version of the truth...or is that someone else's version? How did you come to tha conclusion...sounds like through your modes of perception to me. Trust me, the more of the bullshit you clean out of yourself, and the more you get in tune with who you really are, the clearer your perception becomes.
============================================================
> You have mastered your fears and pains? How can you
> master them? That is like sayingyou are mastering life
> itself. you cannot master life, because life is
> forever changing, forever diong things despite your
> will. When you master your fears and sufferings, you
> are saying that you have battled them, supressed them.
> That is mastery.
============================================================
I cannot master life becuae life involves outside factors, however, I can master the factors which I can control, which include my fears and emotions. Yes my life is forever changing, as is my perception as things become all to clear...I don't supress anything, I let it flow...when I start to feel fear, I instantely make myself aware of what it is that is truelly initiating such instincts, and I play them to my advantage(maybe you don't understand if you have never been able to channel the reaction fear provides into something postive, if is quite an impressive experince. Pain, if I become sad, it is a similar situation: I have found that when i am sad I am most creative. I channel pain into productivity, then release it into the wind. Sometimes I make myself sad and or afraid on purpose now...if you cannot relate to the matery of such things, I would not expect you to understand:)~
------------------------------------------------------------
> YOur fears are still there. You are still lonely:
> Without this web page and all the e-mails and chit
> chats, you will crumble and realize that the mastery
> was nothing but an illusion. You still fear death: If
> you have goals, a future, then how can you not fear
> death? Impossible. You still fear becoming a beggar
> on the street slowly dying from starvation. You still
> fear the loss of your loved ones. When a family member
> passes, you'll suffer inside. Your mastery must be an
> illusion, because nobody can master life.
------------------------------------------------------------
I do not fear any of these things. For one now that I have inner peace, I am often more comfortable by myself contimplating recent experinces then I am when I have to see others toiling away when the answer is so easy.
The only thing that is holding you back from such a state that I have described is your obvious self doubt. You say this is impossible because you do not think you can achieve such a state of being at this present time. Nobody can master life at large, but anyone can master themselves.
------------------------------------------------------------
> However! One can reailze that they are life; truth.
> They can realize that their fears, their suffering and
> death are all illusions created out of attachement.
============================================================
This I agree with.
============================================================
> You say that "fear founds none of my beliefs", yet all
> beliefs are based out of fear. If you believe, you are
> saying "I do not know, but I have faith that it is
> so." Why beileve it is so? Either you know it or not.
> If you do not know it, then keep on giong until you
> know it. Don't say "I believe", because that shows the
> fear you have of not having a conclusion to attach
> yourself to.
============================================================
No, now I believe in myself, I used to be afraid of myself, but I am not anymore.
============================================================
> Have you also mastered your happiness and desires? Do
> you still run from suffering and into happiness? Do
> you run from loneliness and into the verious means of
> communication?
============================================================
I go where I please when I want dude...I am just as likely to chill out and help someone in an undesirable situation as I am to go to a place of "joy". Your question is irrelivant...it is stupid to stand in the cold when you can walk into the house where it is warm.
============================================================
> How about you and I save up $10,000 each. We rent a
> quiet studio where neither of us do anything all day
> but sit there for at least 1 year. No TV, phone,
> internet. All we got is food to eat, water, a
> bath/toilet, and refridgerator. And we will live in
> that studio as if neither of us existed. Nobody else
> aws allowed inside. No books to read. No paper to
> write on; nothing. Just sitting and BEING. Can you do
> such a thing? Can you forget your dreams, desires,
> this web page and everything for at east 1 year? Or
> are you still attached to these things?
============================================================
I could do it, but it would be a waste of time. How about you realize that it is possible to enjoy life and not be addicted to it's trapings...then we would be on the same page with out wasting a year to supliment our ego's in a semi macho whose got the bigger spiritual dick or measure of self peace contest.
============================================================
> Whatsoever you are attached to, wheather it be
> pleasure or truth, then know that these things have
> mastery over you, not vice versa. You are not free of
> these things. And you say suffering and fear fertilize
> your spirit. HOw so? What about happiness and desires?
> Do they not also fuel the fire?
> You are still holding a two sidded coin claiming to
> have only a one sidded coin.
============================================================
Who fed you that? I suppose somebody who wanted you to buy there side of the coin...or is it just your way of try to build a base of control over others?
============================================================
> And you will take offense to this message, because you
> are attached to your idea of truth and when someone
> comes and says "NO, your truth is a projection" then
> you become defensive and anger rises. It has happened
> many times before between you and I. This is because
> you are attached to your idea of truth and when one
> says "no, you are wrong" then that idea begins to
> shake a little and you grow angry because it's not
> supposed to shake! It's not supposed to be contested
> in such a manner. I is OK if one was to say "your
> truth suck!", because then they are operating ou of
> emotional ignorance, but when one posts a serious post
> that dives deeper than your own understanding, then
> the realization that you could be wrong, living in an
> illusion, a self molded prison where you remain safe,
> dawns upon you.
>
> Your truth is a perception, a belief. YOu said it
> yourself. Isn't it time you became truth? To be aware
> to truth you must be ready to die to the past with
> every passing moment. You must be intamate with the
> present. You must not have any desire to change
> WHAT IS. You must accept everything that comes
> your way and love it. "Must" is the wrong word. The
> action comes through understansding.
============================================================
All excepting in an imperfect world is like turining the key to self slavery. Sure, you must except the things you have no power over, but you definately can hold mastery over self. I challange you to do this, and then empower yourself to alter your surroundings to the benfit of the universe. For you to persume that I would be angry at this message means the you are still ASSuming that I am delusional when I tell you that I do have mastery of self. I do enjoy these debates however...

Thank You for your time,
Saint Stephen

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