One solution would be videotaping local comps and having vids assessed by separate panels of judges. Outlying IP points (say, >=5 ranks away from the average placement across 10 judges for the same dancer) would result in probation of some kind. Thus could be applied at random to feis'/judge (like a tax audit) -- New England Irish Dancers

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Subject: One solution would be videotaping local comps and having vids assessed by separate panels of judges. Outlying IP points (say, >=5 ranks away from the average placement across 10 judges for the same dancer) would result in probation of some kind. Thus could be applied at random to feis'/judge (like a tax audit)
Author: Doable	[ Next Thread \| Previous Thread \| Next Message \| Previous Message ] Date Posted: 17:55:18 03/13/24 Wed In reply to: Anon 's message, "Avoid cheating" on 14:51:50 03/01/24 Fri [ Next Thread \| Previous Thread \| Next Message \| Previous Message ]

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[> [> Subject: The power players don't really want the cheating to go away

Author:
and parents are staying at known cheating schools
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Date Posted: 09:25:52 03/14/24 Thu

Ways to remedy this are vast and most of us could come up with ideas to make things more fair, BUT I believe the WILL to change is not there in competitive Irish dance for the majority of schools and parents.

There are still honest schools and TCRGs (and ADCRGs) -thank goodness- but they don't have the majority hand in this and they won't be able to turn this behemoth of an organization around.

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[> [> [> Subject: Well stated.And any parent still paying tuition to a known cheater school is thereby telling the ID world that they fully support cheating.
Author: facts [ Edit \| View ]	Date Posted: 08:00:48 03/15/24 Fri [ Post a Reply to This Message ]

[> [> [> [> Subject: Lots from NE headed to Worlds this week

Author:
and most from the schools we know are cheaters
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Date Posted: 15:24:38 03/22/24 Fri

some suspected going as well- but when you break down the volume of kids that qualified in the NE, most are from the known cheating schools.

this week, most if not all are winging their way to Worlds.

CLRG, with no teeth and no will is continuing their sanctioning of cheating that will inevitably continue at this "world class" event.

such a shame. Going to Worlds really used to mean something, or so we thought at the time. sort of sad to have the blinkers off.

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[> [> Subject: This won't work until competition criteria is better define and scoring system is developed to reflect criteria.

Author:
More inside
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Date Posted: 23:54:47 03/17/24 Sun

As it stands, the life-long exerptise of the judge is what's valued in the scoring. Everyone has a slightly different understanding of what perfect Irish dancing is, and at some levels (Prelim comes to mind), the judges really are left to making their own determination as to what aspect of technique to value more. I agree with some sort of QC system in theory, but not for the system we're currently working with. For example, I judged a prelim a couple years ago where the dancer the two other judges had 1st, I had 11th... Out of like 14. The dancer couldn't treble on time to save their life and I just couldn't get past it, so I marked them accordingly. The other two judges felt the other aspects of their dancing overrode the bad rhythm. I, to this day, vehemently disagree. I can explain with clear reasoning why I did what I did, and I think the other two are insane for overlooking the rhythm issues the way they did. However, on an "audit" based solely on math, I look like I don't know what I'm looking at. But I do.
Now, if scoring could more to a more categorized system with actual marks allocated for different aspects of dancing, that could work, and I think is probably the way we need to go, if Irish dancing is to move forward being taken seriously as a sport. BUT, with it, comes a whole bunch of other alternations to competition format, which would get people complaining for a whole host of other reasons. The other problem (as has happened in figure skating), is people then start choreographing "to the scoresheet" as opposed to using artistic judgement to determine what looks good. It will lead Irish dancing to become even more cookie cutter and generic--in the name of scoring points. I think that flies in the face of what a folk dance form is...

You really can't win here.

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