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Neysa, the posting I stated for "Joan" was for you, because............... -- barb, 08:34:43 04/15/08 Tue [1] (clgrtnt2-port-48.dial.telus.net/161.184.42.48)
it was your origional post and I took it to be Joan's since it is her forum. I wasn't paying proper attention.
Sorry for the confusion. :-# Your brain is working just fine, Neysa. It's my battery that needs recharging. lol
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Thanks Barb...... -- Neysa, 21:11:48 04/14/08 Mon [1] (user-2inik5v.dialup.mindspring.com/165.121.80.191)
I'm glad you mentioned the prayer service for Wednesday evening at the National Basilica, it wasn't on the schedule I downloaded from EWTN.
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Sorry, I meant thanks ,Catie,...... I think it's time for bed. -- Neysa, 21:14:53 04/14/08 Mon [1] (user-2inik5v.dialup.mindspring.com/165.121.80.191)
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I like Pope Benedict's face. He seems kind, and I like his manner. :-) -- Barb, 16:13:34 04/15/08 Tue [1] (clgrtnt5-port-127.dial.telus.net/161.184.48.127)
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Re: I like Pope Benedict's face. He seems kind, and I like his manner. :-) -- Joan, 06:27:55 04/16/08 Wed [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
I think his face is scary. He was better-looking when he was younger. But now--those eyes. They give me the creeps. :0
Joan
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Re: Joan, do you miss Pope John Paul?.............. -- Joan, 14:06:41 04/15/08 Tue [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
I do miss him very much. It's still hard to see him in films of his last few months--the poor man.
The new pope is a very different person, so it's like comparing apples and oranges.
So far I like this pope, too. He just doesn't engender the warm fuzzies like PJP II did.
Joan
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Scary pope. :) -- Joan, 15:50:47 04/15/08 Tue [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
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I'll tell you who's scary these days.....Jimmy Carter!! ................. -- Barb, 16:19:08 04/15/08 Tue [1] (clgrtnt5-port-127.dial.telus.net/161.184.48.127)
The former President has turned into a loose cannon and a frightening anti-semite! For one who once tried to heal, he is tearing nations apart! What the H... has happened to the man is anyone's guess! :-#
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Re: I'll tell you who's scary these days.....Jimmy Carter!! ................. -- Joan, 16:39:28 04/15/08 Tue [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
Bob said that same thing yesterday! He didn't go into specifics, and I haven't seen or heard a thing of him.
What is he up to?
Joan
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I agree, Jimmy Carter has gone too far. He speaks as a mad man! -- Catie, 18:07:54 04/15/08 Tue [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
Here are a few examples I've read:
For one thing, he claims that in 1967 Israel launched a preemptive attack against Jordan. The fact is that Jordan attacked Israel first, Israel tried desperately to persuade Jordan to remain out of the war, and Israel counterattacked after the Jordanian army surrounded Jerusalem, firing missiles into the center of the city. Only then did Israel capture the West Bank, which it was willing to return in exchange for peace and recognition from Jordan.
Mr. Carter repeatedly mentions Security Council Resolution 242, which called for return of captured territories in exchange for peace, recognition, and secure boundaries, but he ignores that Israel accepted and all the Arab nations and the Palestinians rejected this resolution. The Arabs met in Khartum and issued their three famous "no's": "No peace, no recognition, no negotiation." But you wouldn't know that from reading the history according to Mr. Carter.
Mr. Carter faults Israel for its "air strike that destroyed an Iraqi nuclear reactor" without mentioning that Iraq had threatened to attack Israel with nuclear weapons if Iraq succeeded in building a bomb.
Mr. Carter faults Israel for its administration of Christian and Muslim religious sites, when in fact Israel is scrupulous about ensuring those of every religion the right to worship as they please — consistent, of course, with security needs. He fails to mention that between 1948 and 1967, when Jordan occupied the West Bank and East Jerusalem, the Hashemites destroyed and desecrated Jewish religious sites and prevented Jews from praying at the Western Wall. He also never mentions Egypt's brutal occupation of Gaza between 1949 and 1967.
Mr. Carter blames Israel, and exonerates Arafat!!
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Thank you for such an intelligent and informed post, Catie............. -- Barb, 08:48:56 04/16/08 Wed [1] (clgrtnt2-port-126.dial.telus.net/161.184.42.126)
Jimmy Carter wrote a book and re-wrote history, blaming Israel for virtually everything that is wrong in the Middle East. He is distorting every fact...and now he wants to rub shoulders with Hamas leaders too. Like I said, a loose cannon and a dangerous man!
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Re: Thank you for such an intelligent and informed post, Catie............. -- Joan, 10:24:42 04/16/08 Wed [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
Well, now that everyone is bashing the guy, I can safely admit that I *never* liked him as a president. He was lousy!
OK, I've said it. I feel better. :)
Joan
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Joan I didn't even vote for him. And he's a Georgian. -- Catie, 12:19:52 04/16/08 Wed [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
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His accent drives me crazy. His is SOUTHERN GA accent. -- Catie, 12:21:50 04/16/08 Wed [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
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We used to think his brother Billy was half crazy, but......... -- Barb, 16:13:36 04/16/08 Wed [1] (clgrtnt7-port-94.dial.telus.net/161.184.52.94)
maybe we had the wrong brother!
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I remember Billy Beer! -- Neysa, 17:25:09 04/16/08 Wed [1] (user-2inik0u.dialup.mindspring.com/165.121.80.30)
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My parent's voted for him! -- Neysa, 17:28:08 04/16/08 Wed [1] (user-2inik0u.dialup.mindspring.com/165.121.80.30)
When Jimmy and Rosalynn talk you can't understand a word they say....my mom used to say why don't they open their mouth when they speak.
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There's is a very typical Southern Georgia accent. When I was in -- Catie, 18:07:53 04/16/08 Wed [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
his hometown, EVERYONE spoke like them. And I wondered why to folks in the movies portray such bad accents. Then I realized they are imitating the South part of Georgia -accents I had not be exposed to before my late teens. Northern and some of the East coast Georgians have their own accent too. Kind of like North Carolina vs, Outter Banks and Virginia vs W.VA. To me here in north GA our accent is not as "thick" as Southern GA, or maybe it it, but it's specific words which are pronounced differently. When I visited PA I was in the PA Dutch area. I literally did not understand a word the lady at the store said to me. But my nephews hail from PA and a former roommate so I knew it was just that area that sounded that way.
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"Their's...not There's" I grow worse day by day. Grrrr. -- catie, 18:10:52 04/16/08 Wed [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
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Re: "Their's...not There's" I grow worse day by day. Grrrr. -- Joan, 10:24:59 04/17/08 Thu [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
It's not just you Catie. I'm getting really bad.
I find myself saying things like, "There's 6 left." Yikes! I would never say "There is 6 left." But I shorted it and it never comes out "There're", which is also horrible. But at least if I stretched it out, it would be right. It sounds so horrible--It even grates on *me*. And yet I hear myself doing it all the time now. I know that it's just being lazy/sloppy, but I can't seem to stop it. It pops out, and I'm appalled. I guess the only way to stop it is to correct myself and then say it right every time.
I knew my eyesight and hearing would go. But English, too?!
Joan
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ME a poor English student?!! Unpossible!! -- Catie, 15:56:59 04/17/08 Thu [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
I scare myself more each day. I am not kidding. Once upon a time....oh well we won't go there. I should have guessed my good grammar would have left me just like the size 8 I once took for granted. Life! ppfftt!
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"Englosh!" lol I would be scared to re-enter 8th grade! I'd never get out! :-( -- Barb, 08:03:10 04/18/08 Fri [1] (clgrtnt9-port-113.dial.telus.net/161.184.54.113)
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Catie......... -- Neysa, 23:05:51 04/16/08 Wed [1] (user-38lci5g.dialup.mindspring.com/209.86.72.176)
I remember you saying that your nephews come from my home town....we do not have a PA Dutch accent. We have a coal region accent, thank goodness I do not have it. My mom made sure if it. Now a lot of farmers in the area have the PA Dutch accent. It is mostly people who live around Lancaster, York, Camp Hill, they have the PA Dutch accent...none of them are farmers. ( By the way the Pennsylvania Dutch are of German ancestry... years ago when asked they said they came from Duetchland ...not sure of the German spelling for Germany ...people thought they said they were Dutch).
My mom and I met a couple from Southern Georgia. The woman said that she and her husband lived near the border of Florida. She said they lived there all their lives. The woman's accent was so soft and she pronounced every word clearly. I said to her that I hope she wouldn't be offended, you could hardly tell she had a southern accent. She said she was a retired high school English teacher.
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Forgot to mention Catie,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, -- Neysa, 23:25:45 04/16/08 Wed [1] (user-38lci5g.dialup.mindspring.com/209.86.72.176)
I love southern accents. Except for the deep hard southern accent like the Carter's.
It is so amazing how we all live in the same country USA, yet we all have different accents. Even within our own states.
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Neysa....remember England! lol -- Barb, 12:43:03 04/17/08 Thu [1] (clgrtnt9-port-33.dial.telus.net/161.184.54.33)
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What the letter really said. -- Joan, 16:03:39 04/15/08 Tue [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
"With the publication of the papal encyclical Dies Domini some years ago, Rome’s agenda was made public, to persuade all nations to legislate a national day of rest which is not in harmony with the principles religious liberty."
I don't mean to sound harsh. But I wonder where you get your information on the Catholic Church. I know that there are some anti-Catholic sites (some--what an understatement). And I know of several anti-Catholic books that claim to tell the true story about Catholicism. I suggest that you check the facts for yourself. Someone is playing with you.
Here is the text of the letter, which someone told you exorted all nations to institute a day of rest. It's written to Catholics and asks them to remember what Sunday is really about.
APOSTOLIC LETTER
DIES DOMINI
OF THE HOLY FATHER
JOHN PAUL II
TO THE BISHOPS, CLERGY AND FAITHFUL
OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH
ON KEEPING THE LORD'S DAY HOLY
My esteemed Brothers in the Episcopate
and the Priesthood,
Dear Brothers and Sisters!
1. The Lord's Day — as Sunday was called from Apostolic times(1) — has always been accorded special attention in the history of the Church because of its close connection with the very core of the Christian mystery. In fact, in the weekly reckoning of time Sunday recalls the day of Christ's Resurrection. It is Easter which returns week by week, celebrating Christ's victory over sin and death, the fulfilment in him of the first creation and the dawn of "the new creation" (cf. 2 Cor 5:17). It is the day which recalls in grateful adoration the world's first day and looks forward in active hope to "the last day", when Christ will come in glory (cf. Acts 1:11; 1 Th 4:13-17) and all things will be made new (cf. Rev 21:5).
Rightly, then, the Psalmist's cry is applied to Sunday: "This is the day which the Lord has made: let us rejoice and be glad in it" (Ps 118:24). This invitation to joy, which the Easter liturgy makes its own, reflects the astonishment which came over the women who, having seen the crucifixion of Christ, found the tomb empty when they went there "very early on the first day after the Sabbath" (Mk 16:2). It is an invitation to relive in some way the experience of the two disciples of Emmaus, who felt their hearts "burn within them" as the Risen One walked with them on the road, explaining the Scriptures and revealing himself in "the breaking of the bread" (cf. Lk 24:32,35). And it echoes the joy — at first uncertain and then overwhelming — which the Apostles experienced on the evening of that same day, when they were visited by the Risen Jesus and received the gift of his peace and of his Spirit (cf. Jn 20:19-23).
2. The Resurrection of Jesus is the fundamental event upon which Christian faith rests (cf. 1 Cor 15:14). It is an astonishing reality, fully grasped in the light of faith, yet historically attested to by those who were privileged to see the Risen Lord. It is a wondrous event which is not only absolutely unique in human history, but which lies at the very heart of the mystery of time. In fact, "all time belongs to [Christ] and all the ages", as the evocative liturgy of the Easter Vigil recalls in preparing the Paschal Candle. Therefore, in commemorating the day of Christ's Resurrection not just once a year but every Sunday, the Church seeks to indicate to every generation the true fulcrum of history, to which the mystery of the world's origin and its final destiny leads.
It is right, therefore, to claim, in the words of a fourth century homily, that "the Lord's Day" is "the lord of days".(2) Those who have received the grace of faith in the Risen Lord cannot fail to grasp the significance of this day of the week with the same deep emotion which led Saint Jerome to say: "Sunday is the day of the Resurrection, it is the day of Christians, it is our day".(3) For Christians, Sunday is "the fundamental feastday",(4) established not only to mark the succession of time but to reveal time's deeper meaning.
3. The fundamental importance of Sunday has been recognized through two thousand years of history and was emphatically restated by the Second Vatican Council: "Every seven days, the Church celebrates the Easter mystery. This is a tradition going back to the Apostles, taking its origin from the actual day of Christ's Resurrection — a day thus appropriately designated 'the Lord's Day'."(5) Paul VI emphasized this importance once more when he approved the new General Roman Calendar and the Universal Norms which regulate the ordering of the Liturgical Year.(6) The coming of the Third Millennium, which calls believers to reflect upon the course of history in the light of Christ, also invites them to rediscover with new intensity the meaning of Sunday: its "mystery", its celebration, its significance for Christian and human life.
I note with pleasure that in the years since the Council this important theme has prompted not only many interventions by you, dear Brother Bishops, as teachers of the faith, but also different pastoral strategies which — with the support of your clergy — you have developed either individually or jointly. On the threshold of the Great Jubilee of the Year 2000, it has been my wish to offer you this Apostolic Letter in order to support your pastoral efforts in this vital area. But at the same time I wish to turn to all of you, Christ's faithful, as though I were spiritually present in all the communities in which you gather with your Pastors each Sunday to celebrate the Eucharist and "the Lord's Day". Many of the insights and intuitions which prompt this Apostolic Letter have grown from my episcopal service in Krakow and, since the time when I assumed the ministry of Bishop of Rome and Successor of Peter, in the visits to the Roman parishes which I have made regularly on the Sundays of the different seasons of the Liturgical Year. I see this Letter as continuing the lively exchange which I am always happy to have with the faithful, as I reflect with you on the meaning of Sunday and underline the reasons for living Sunday as truly "the Lord's Day", also in the changing circumstances of our own times.
4. Until quite recently, it was easier in traditionally Christian countries to keep Sunday holy because it was an almost universal practice and because, even in the organization of civil society, Sunday rest was considered a fixed part of the work schedule. Today, however, even in those countries which give legal sanction to the festive character of Sunday, changes in socioeconomic conditions have often led to profound modifications of social behaviour and hence of the character of Sunday. The custom of the "weekend" has become more widespread, a weekly period of respite, spent perhaps far from home and often involving participation in cultural, political or sporting activities which are usually held on free days. This social and cultural phenomenon is by no means without its positive aspects if, while respecting true values, it can contribute to people's development and to the advancement of the life of society as a whole. All of this responds not only to the need for rest, but also to the need for celebration which is inherent in our humanity. Unfortunately, when Sunday loses its fundamental meaning and becomes merely part of a "weekend", it can happen that people stay locked within a horizon so limited that they can no longer see "the heavens".(7) Hence, though ready to celebrate, they are really incapable of doing so.
The disciples of Christ, however, are asked to avoid any confusion between the celebration of Sunday, which should truly be a way of keeping the Lord's Day holy, and the "weekend", understood as a time of simple rest and relaxation. This will require a genuine spiritual maturity, which will enable Christians to "be what they are", in full accordance with the gift of faith, always ready to give an account of the hope which is in them (cf. 1 Pt 3:15). In this way, they will be led to a deeper understanding of Sunday, with the result that, even in difficult situations, they will be able to live it in complete docility to the Holy Spirit.
5. From this perspective, the situation appears somewhat mixed. On the one hand, there is the example of some young Churches, which show how fervently Sunday can be celebrated, whether in urban areas or in widely scattered villages. By contrast, in other parts of the world, because of the sociological pressures already noted, and perhaps because the motivation of faith is weak, the percentage of those attending the Sunday liturgy is strikingly low. In the minds of many of the faithful, not only the sense of the centrality of the Eucharist but even the sense of the duty to give thanks to the Lord and to pray to him with others in the community of the Church, seems to be diminishing.
It is also true that both in mission countries and in countries evangelized long ago the lack of priests is such that the celebration of the Sunday Eucharist cannot always be guaranteed in every community.
6. Given this array of new situations and the questions which they prompt, it seems more necessary than ever to recover the deep doctrinal foundations underlying the Church's precept, so that the abiding value of Sunday in the Christian life will be clear to all the faithful. In doing this, we follow in the footsteps of the age-old tradition of the Church, powerfully restated by the Second Vatican Council in its teaching that on Sunday "Christian believers should come together, in order to commemorate the suffering, Resurrection and glory of the Lord Jesus, by hearing God's Word and sharing the Eucharist, and to give thanks to God who has given them new birth to a living hope through the Resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead (cf. 1 Pt 1:3)".(8)
7. The duty to keep Sunday holy, especially by sharing in the Eucharist and by relaxing in a spirit of Christian joy and fraternity, is easily understood if we consider the many different aspects of this day upon which the present Letter will focus our attention.
Sunday is a day which is at the very heart of the Christian life. From the beginning of my Pontificate, I have not ceased to repeat: "Do not be afraid! Open, open wide the doors to Christ!".(9) In the same way, today I would strongly urge everyone to rediscover Sunday: Do not be afraid to give your time to Christ! Yes, let us open our time to Christ, that he may cast light upon it and give it direction. He is the One who knows the secret of time and the secret of eternity, and he gives us "his day" as an ever new gift of his love. The rediscovery of this day is a grace which we must implore, not only so that we may live the demands of faith to the full, but also so that we may respond concretely to the deepest human yearnings. Time given to Christ is never time lost, but is rather time gained, so that our relationships and indeed our whole life may become more profoundly human.
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Joan, -- Catie, 18:04:16 04/15/08 Tue [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
Thank you. I am happy to read the entire letter, in it's correct form. I try to be wise in filtering through information but I am capable of missing something or making a mistake. That's why I stated I was only offering my opinion.
As you know I have friends, one who is very close and special, who are Catholic. I have nothing against Catholics, honestly I don't. But you are right. I "fear" for lack of a better word, that the Vatican itself has too much power. Religion and politics don't mix. Rome has it's own reasons and I have no reason to speak out against their laws,rules,et al, but sometimes I think you as a Catholic either under estimate the power of the Vatican or are perhaps fully understand their power and are trying to help me, as a protestant, to feel better about it. Catholics per se I have no negative words for, but the Vatican and all of its power really concerns me.
The letter seems to be adamant in offering a lot of explaining as to why Sunday is the Lord's day?? Just my point of view at least. But that's probably because in my understanding the bible, clearly Sunday is not the Sabbath. We simply disagree. Not keeping the true Sabbath is breaking a ten commandment that God himself ordained as his day of worship, & the only commandment he said to be sure to "Remember". So then why is Saturday vs. Sunday such an issue? I think I would have ask the author of the letter why the emphasis so much on Sunday. But that's just me. :)
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Re: Joan, -- Joan, 05:36:20 04/16/08 Wed [1] (ip68-0-253-131.ri.ri.cox.net/68.0.253.131)
The letter wasn't about Sat vs Sun. It was about the Lord's Day, which is Sunday. The pope was stressing that Sunday, the Lord's Day, is so important that it should be treated as an Easter every week.
Catholics don't think that Sunday is the Sabbath, so the wasn't a Sabbath vs Sunday teatise.
There are other Catholic papers on the Sabbath and Sunday, including some things from the early centuries. But again. that's not what this letter was about.
The letter was really about getting Catholics to treat Sunday like they should -- at least go to Church, if nothing else. :)
There is no Catholic conspiracy to fool you into relaxing about this supposed Catholic power. You do realize that the Vatican can't get so many Catholics to stay married, stop using birth control, stop having sex outside marriage, to get to church on Sunday, or to do so many other things.
Thinking that the Vatican can control the president, congress, or you when it can't control Catholics is a stretch. :)
What kind of power do you think the Vatican has over the American government?
Joan
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Re: Joan, -- Catie, 06:54:17 04/16/08 Wed [1] (h211.26.40.69.ip.alltel.net/69.40.26.211)
Well as paranoid as it may sound, I feel the government, -American that is-, has more pull than "we the people" know. I trust GW as far as I can throw him. (which is a bit beside the point of Catholicism) So it's really Bush I don't trust in this meeting! lol As for the Vatican and its subjects, well who knows? I guess if they can't control their own folks, haven't killed anyone yet for disobeying their rules, there's really no reason to be concerned then. :)
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